Super Sonic

Super Sonic 1.1.1

Icezer

Local Ice Cube. Robotic Hedgehog Enthusiast.
What do you think each shield should do to Super Sonic? Especially shields that don't have a passive ability (such as ring attraction).

Force Shield:
Decreases rate of ring drain to 8/10 (80%) of the normal ring drain. (i originally thought 3/4 but that'd be op)

Armageddon Shield:
Next time you use the Speed Thok, the Armageddon Blast activates.

Attraction Shield:
Doesn't need an extra ability, the passive ring attraction is useful enough.

Elemental Shield:
Probably also doesn't need an extra ability, it makes you unable to drown underwater or in space. But that does mean that it would be useless above water.

Whirlwind Shield:
Decreases Super Sonic's gravity... or increases his jump height and makes him fall slightly slower.

Flame Shield:
I have no idea, flame trails??? I really have no idea.
Bubble Shield:
Unable to drown when underwater or space passive.
Lightning Shield:
Ring Attraction passive.
Just for fun I jotted down a list of shield stuff, but nothing is set in stone so don't expect anything.

Elemental - No additional ability, has drown immunity/flame trail
Armageddon - Charge Thok, fully charging will cause nuke
Attraction - No additional ability
Wind - Thok > Jump Thok
Force - 80% ring drain down from 100% 9I couldn't think of a different ability from Pyrakid's)
Flame - Thok power buff
Bubble - Thok > Bounce Thok
Thunder - Slightly more vertical Jump Thok
 
Just for fun I jotted down a list of shield stuff, but nothing is set in stone so don't expect anything.

Elemental - No additional ability, has drown immunity/flame trail
Armageddon - Charge Thok, fully charging will cause nuke
Attraction - No additional ability
Wind - Thok > Jump Thok
Force - 80% ring drain down from 100% 9I couldn't think of a different ability from Pyrakid's)
Flame - Thok power buff
Bubble - Thok > Bounce Thok
Thunder - Slightly more vertical Jump Thok

Here's a crazy idea: what if you just gave Super Sonic active shield abilities (with some Super buffs) using Jump+Spin, replacing his hover ability until the shield is deactivated? It would balance out gameplay such that players would need to choose whether they wanted a particular shield's active ability more than hover for a segment of the level. Here are some scenarios where shields may be more useful:

Main Shields
  • Low on rings: Grab the Attraction Shield to stock up on rings, or use homing-attacks on several enemies in quick succession. Maybe add a +1 ring multiplier bonus for every enemy you chain together in one jump. Alternatively, grab the Armageddon Shield and clear out a whole area of both enemies and rings in one single blast.
  • Precise platforming: Grab the Force Shield and use its insta-stop ability to cancel Super Sonic's crazy momentum when traversing pits you cannot otherwise jump or hover across. (I cannot begin to tell you how many times I went flying off a platform in CEZ and ACZ, only to hover and realize I have nowhere to hover toward except to a death pit below). As an added safety net, maybe buff the insta-stop with hover-descent, so Super Sonic gradually sets down rather than just drops. Helpful if you activate the insta-stop too early/late and need to reach the ledge.
  • Avoid crush death: Possible retooling of Force Shield's passive ability. Since Super Sonic cannot ordinarily take damage, but can be crushed, this will let him survive 2 crushes before the shield deactivates.
  • Destruction ground pound: Grab the Elemental Shield to destroy enemies and spikes within a certain radius of Super Sonic after hitting the ground, and break open floors only meant for Amy and Fang. Buffed ground-pound also makes it easier to reach the very bottom of the goo pits in THZ and HHZ.
  • Resist water currents: Possible expansion to Elemental Shield's passive ability. Along with not drowning, this buff means Super Sonic won't be swept away by water currents in GFZ, THZ, DSZ, etc, allowing him to preserve momentum and access areas only Tails or Knuckles can.
  • Reach areas that are too high up: Grab the Whirlwind Shield to essentially double Super Sonic's jump height (either by buffing the standard jump boost, or adding a second consecutive jump boost).
Edit: Sonic 3 Shields
  • Destruction flame dash: Grab the Flame Shield to break open walls only meant for Knuckles and Amy using a flame dash. To distinguish it from the thok, the flame dash wouldn't cover as much distance, as per usual.
  • Jump warp: Grab the Lightning Shield to zap or "warp" twice in the direction you hold. Basically, Shadow's Chaos Control ability, but using the standard Lightning Shield sprites. (Would be a lifesaver in AGZ for sure.)
  • Escape death pits: Grab the Bubble Shield to floor-bounce off anything, including spikes, water, and death pits. To make things fair, bouncing into a death pit would "pop" the bubble (i.e. deactivating the shield) and launch Super Sonic back out to safety.

Of course, a potential issue with this plan is how to deactivate shields at will and return his ability to hover once more, since Super Sonic cannot get hurt. A time limit, similar to Invincibility and Speed Shoes, wouldn't be fair for certain shields with really useful passive abilities, like the Elemental Shield. A potential option is to give each shield a limited number of active ability usages. Armageddon Shield already deactivates after 1 use, but maybe Attraction, Elemental, Force, and Whirlwind Shields deactivate after, say, 10-20 homing attacks, ground-pounds, insta-stops, and double jumps, respectively. Ditto for Sonic 3 shields. So if you value that shield's passive ability, don't spam its active ability. Otherwise, if you want hovering back, spam away until the shield is gone.

Anyway, that's my pitch. What do you think?
 
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Here's a crazy idea: what if you just gave Super Sonic active shield abilities (with some Super buffs) using Jump+Spin, replacing his hover ability until the shield is deactivated? It would balance out gameplay such that players would need to choose whether they wanted a particular shield's active ability more than hover for a segment of the level. Here are some scenarios where shields may be more useful:

Main Shields
  • Low on rings: Grab the Attraction Shield to stock up on rings, or use homing-attacks on several enemies in quick succession. Maybe add a +1 ring multiplier bonus for every enemy you chain together in one jump. Alternatively, grab the Armageddon Shield and clear out a whole area of both enemies and rings in one single blast.
  • Precise platforming: Grab the Force Shield and use its insta-stop ability to cancel Super Sonic's crazy momentum when traversing pits you cannot otherwise jump or hover across. (I cannot begin to tell you how many times I went flying off a platform in CEZ and ACZ, only to hover and realize I have nowhere to hover toward except to a death pit below). As an added safety net, maybe buff the insta-stop with hover-descent, so Super Sonic gradually sets down rather than just drops. Helpful if you activate the insta-stop too early/late and need to reach the ledge.
  • Avoid crush death: Possible retooling of Force Shield's passive ability. Since Super Sonic cannot ordinarily take damage, but can be crushed, this will let him survive 2 crushes before the shield deactivates.
  • Destruction ground pound: Grab the Elemental Shield to destroy enemies and spikes within a certain radius of Super Sonic after hitting the ground, and break open floors only meant for Amy and Fang. Buffed ground-pound also makes it easier to reach the very bottom of the goo pits in THZ and HHZ.
  • Resist water currents: Possible expansion to Elemental Shield's passive ability. Along with not drowning, this buff means Super Sonic won't be swept away by water currents in GFZ, THZ, DSZ, etc, allowing him to preserve momentum and access areas only Tails or Knuckles can.
  • Reach areas that are too high up: Grab the Whirlwind Shield to essentially double Super Sonic's jump height (either by buffing the standard jump boost, or adding a second consecutive jump boost).
Edit: Sonic 3 Shields
  • Destruction flame dash: Grab the Flame Shield to break open walls only meant for Knuckles and Amy using a flame dash. To distinguish it from the thok, the flame dash wouldn't cover as much distance, as per usual.
  • Jump warp: Grab the Lightning Shield to zap or "warp" twice in the direction you hold. Basically, Shadow's Chaos Control ability, but using the standard Lightning Shield sprites. (Would be a lifesaver in AGZ for sure.)
  • Escape death pits: Grab the Bubble Shield to floor-bounce off anything, including spikes, water, and death pits. To make things fair, bouncing into a death pit would "pop" the bubble (i.e. deactivating the shield) and launch Super Sonic back out to safety.

Of course, a potential issue with this plan is how to deactivate shields at will and return his ability to hover once more, since Super Sonic cannot get hurt. A time limit, similar to Invincibility and Speed Shoes, wouldn't be fair for certain shields with really useful passive abilities, like the Elemental Shield. A potential option is to give each shield a limited number of active ability usages. Armageddon Shield already deactivates after 1 use, but maybe Attraction, Elemental, Force, and Whirlwind Shields deactivate after, say, 10-20 homing attacks, ground-pounds, insta-stops, and double jumps, respectively. Ditto for Sonic 3 shields. So if you value that shield's passive ability, don't spam its active ability. Otherwise, if you want hovering back, spam away until the shield is gone.

Anyway, that's my pitch. What do you think?

Those are some cool ideas but do you realize how complex Shadow's chaos snap is? From scratch too? I feel like that's waaay too much to code, i dont think he needs to have jump+spin abilities, and the whole design philosphy in srb2 is that finding a shield is always rewarding, not a "decide whether you want this shield that you earned or not" thing, unless you already have a certain shield that you want to keep.

Also deactivate after 10-20 homing attacks? Why not just don't use the homing attack at all and keep the ring attraction? Homing attacking isn't that useful when you can just walk into enemies at a very high speed.

I like my idea about new passives more.
I was hesitant about saying thok buff for the flame shield because i didnt really know how useful that would be, but icezer couldnt come up with something different from what i thought originally so thats fair.


COMPLETELY DIFFERENT TOPIC:
In case my other post about super being invincible wasn't clear. I think a good idea is to make Super Sonic not fully invincible, but rather "pretty much invincible". You still have to dodge attacks to avoid getting punished, but the punishment is much less severe. This would keep bosses a bit more interesting because you still have to worry about their attacks, instead of just waiting to ram your body into them.
 

gamthegamer

a idiot
In case my other post about super being invincible wasn't clear. I think a good idea is to make Super Sonic not fully invincible, but rather "pretty much invincible". You still have to dodge attacks to avoid getting punished, but the punishment is much less severe. This would keep bosses a bit more interesting because you still have to worry about their attacks, instead of just waiting to ram your body into them.
i think it could be like a doomsday zone thing, when you get hit you have knockback but no rings loss.
 
i think it could be like a doomsday zone thing, when you get hit you have knockback but no rings loss.
That works because you're chasing the boss, when you're not chasing anything it makes more sense to lose rings (similarly to how you lose TIME in NiGHTS special stages)
 

Icezer

Local Ice Cube. Robotic Hedgehog Enthusiast.
Icezer updated Super Sonic with a new update entry:

Version 1.1.1

Heya! Some of the bigger stuff is still getting worked on and isn't quite ready yet, but there's 1 quality of life feature I wanted to implement sooner rather than later.

Super Sonic now has ring attraction!
View attachment 54498
It should be noted that the pull of said attraction is very weak, and will only really trigger if you get close enough to a ring where you could almost physically touch it. This change was implemented mainly to help with the fact that...

Read the rest of this update entry...
 

Icezer

Local Ice Cube. Robotic Hedgehog Enthusiast.
May I ask,why doesn't Super Sonic start with 50 rings
Super starts with 25 since starting with 50 would make him a bit easier to play from spawn, and there's no concrete instance of him detransforming... (:
 
Super starts with 25 since starting with 50 would make him a bit easier to play from spawn, and there's no concrete instance of him detransforming... (:
I think a setting/command to change how much rings he starts with would be a good idea. That's only because the exsistance of Custom Levels. Yep, you can't beat Cyberdime, ODLC levels, UDLC levels, 24-Hour Collab... And that's just the top of the list. Heck, Multiplayer just a Free Coupon to Death. So I propose a command or setting to change how much rings Super Sonic Starts with.

Command Name: SuperStart

Infinite: Recommend for Multiplayer levels, Chill Outs, Battle, Chaos Mode, And for people getting the hang of this character. Like playing Survival mode on Peaceful.

Easy: 100 Rings, you baby. If possible disables drowning.

Neutral: 50 Rings, for those who played Sonic. Essentially... This feels like Sonic 2 with powerful air dash, and Mania flight... But odd.

Default: 25 Rings. The default.

Hard: 15 Rings. As compensation, you get Attraction Shield at start.

Hardcore: 15 Rings, but no Attraction Shield, and no Shield Abilities either. For Pros.

Also, maybe Sonic BTS' Secret boss theme (Unstoppable ~ For Extra Boss, AKA, the X-Momentum Hyper Theme) play, as a nod to Sonic 2.

Either way, the ring settings would help this character with a lot. And I mean being able to run through every level map in the MB, without worrying about the level having little to no rings.
I died on Jade Coast 2. JADE. COAST. 2. Heck, I was barely able to beat Sol Sestancia.
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Edit: I still recommend it, but I found out it is possible to beat Cyberdime, but not a deathless run. But... Overall it's hard.
 
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I think the option for 50 is good if it helps make him more compatible with other maps, or makes the game more beatable in ultimate mode, etc. I think its a good argument that if you're going to kill the player for failing to keep their ring count up maybe 50 isnt too much to ask for, however i understand being worried about it making the challenge too easy
 
It does. Sonic literally starts with 50 in official sega ages version of sonic 2
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Hyper sonic?
 
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