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Amanda The Hedgehog

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Zeshiro said:
Still missing the point, sadly. It's not about the recolor itself. It's about knowing that have something unoriginal and that it needs to be changed. Not that you have something unoriginal and you need to quit. But you have something unoriginal and it needs to be changed. It's not about "How to make a recolor, and what it won't do for you", it's about "What did you learn from your horrbile attempt at making a wad?"
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The problem is that they haven't learned, ever. They start, then quit, then start, then quit. It's not like recolors have proven themselves to be a successful learning experience. It hasn't happened yet.

Zeshiro said:
What I'm saying is, that this is purely a learning experience. And "the essentials"..? That seems more like a list of what's essential to you. And as for making and S_SKIN: That's why we have this.
And what do you mean an insignificant ammount of learning animation? Looking at something and how it moves frame by frame is the most basic form of animation. Pictures in a sequence is animation. If you can imitate it, you can recreate it. It's about learning how things move. You're now assuming that the person who is making the recolor is mentally challenge, or not intelligent enough to grasp basic concepts. You're making wadding a character seem more complicated than it is.
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Unfortunately, you are wrong here. Essentials are just that, essentials. Not essential to one person. What basics a character needs are essentials, and recolors have that already done for them, so it's not the learning experience you make it out to be. They aren't imitating the sprites. They are using each and every pre-made sprite in their characters and drawing junk on top of it. To understand basic design of a character, they need to be able to animate correctly, align correctly, and work in all the angles. Since this is already done, they are not learning that.

Zeshiro said:
The fact is, there's no right or wrong way. I understand you're trying to come up with an efficient way, but there are different degrees of efficiency. I could save tons of money year from not buy gas if I just walked everywhere. But I'd just be late to everywhere I go. It's just a matter of opinion.
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But your metaphor does not logically make sense in this situation, as it does not clue in remotely to the issue at hand. There are no similarities. And as for "right" and "wrong", I've stated how that there is, in fact, a right and wrong way to do this.

Zeshiro said:
But to say that your methods work better than the methods of others, again: Arrogant.
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That's true, only if it's presented in an unproven, assertive way. I fail to see either of those as having taken effect in this instance. My method is proven. I did not assert that it was the absolute best. Ratherm I cited it as an example.
 
First of all, the metaphor was to show that you could make avalid point to an opinoin, that won't make it better. And once and for all, what I'm trying to say is not that it's not about learning to recolor something. It's about failing miserably and learning about how and why you failed. You break it down and develope a better understanding of what it is you're working wtih. And not to discourage people just because they're recoloring. Tell them what about each bit and peice of why it fails. And do it without insulting them. It's not necessary. You're trailing off here.. I'm making a point, just analyze what I'm saying and you'll see that it's not far off. They need to learn each part of making a wad. (Including your essentials.) But just because they tried starting with recoloring, you don't make them quit wadding. You tell them to try again. Exactly like a video game. Sometimes you need to lose to learn how to win. Why's that so hard to understand?
 
You break it down and develop a better understanding of what it is you're working with. And not to discourage people just because they're recoloring. Tell them what about each bit and piece of why it fails. And do it without insulting them.
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I believe this is the key operative sentence in your post. And I will address it be saying that I have, in fact, stated why it does not, will not, and can not work. I'm discouraging recoloring simply because they've plagued the boards long enough, they're a tried and failed method, and I've explained why.

Also, on that last sentence, I do not see where I insulted someone here. Please show me where in this topic I have done that.
 
It's a general statement, first of all. I'm generally stating that flaming someone for starting wad because it's a recolor does nothing. And have you ever thought perhaps the try/fail method never works because people quit to early? The willingness to continue depends on the individual. People generally quit ahead of time because everyone discourages them from even trying. You can't just generally state that everyone who starts with a recolor has no future in wadding. They're taking one of many paths to the same destination. You could say there are "better" paths. But what I'm saying is, that's better to you. Even if it's the better way to majority of people, that doesn't mean it's better for eveyone. This may not be the fast way, but it's the easy way. Worry about the details later, and focus on the character. Or, worry about the dtails and focus on the character later. All in all, you need every element to make a good wad. So each part is an essential, no matter how small. It doesn't matter how you approach it.

-Edit- Either way, we've hijacked this topic long enough. Let's not go into another page on this. Just close it with a statement or something, if you can.
 
You two just quit it, if she wants to make this wad, she can make it however she wants, it may be a recolor it may not be a recolor in other people's eyes. In my eyes it's a good character, yes it may need some fixing here and there, but we all started the same way, or at least most of us did. My characters may have parts of the original characters but at least I started with something, so she should too. And if she needs any help with designing the character I'll be happy to help out.
 
The problem is that when they do quit, there are thirty + people screaming "No! FINISH IT! I WANTS!!!" which in turn brings them back to square one. Then they quit again. The second time around, "Ask for help, people will help you", in where they not only fail to learn how to make it, but introduce another, unoriginal, boring, repetitive, etc. recolor into the boards, with no gain on any end whatsoever.
 
Senku_the_swordshog said:
You two just quit it, if she wants to make this wad, she can make it however she wants, it may be a recolor it may not be a recolor in other people's eyes. In my eyes my characters may have parts of the original characters but at least I started with something. So just drop it. And if she needs any help with designing the character I'll be happy to help out.
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Senku, you really should read from page one. I've supported her from my first post in this topic. I'm being realistic and saying that people are going to call it an unoriginal recolor. And I've told her what she can do if she wants to change that. Also stating that it's not about what the actual character looks like, it's about learning what you're doing.

Dark Warrior said:
The problem is that when they do quit, there are thirty + people screaming "No! FINISH IT! I WANTS!!!" which in turn brings them back to square one. Then they quit again. The second time around, "Ask for help, people will help you", in where they not only fail to learn how to make it, but introduce another, unoriginal, boring, repetitive, etc. recolor into the boards, with no gain on any end whatsoever.
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Therein lies the answer. Don't make them quit to begin with. Which is what I've been trying to do.
 
Oh ok, seems I didnt keep everything I read in the front of my mind. Well anyways, just lets let her do sprites at least it is better than having no character at all, plus SRB2 CAN get boring without something new to use with it, so this character when or if finish WILL be downloaded by me.
 
The problem is that they did learn when they first quit. Hence my reference "square one." If they acknowledged the fact, and said no, and did not take the "FINISH IT!!11!" posts, it would be a lot less painless.
 
Dark, just "STOP" as Furious would put it. I am done argueing cause I don't wanna get banned for trying to support someone in a good wad.
 
>_> If I want to call you Dray, I'll call you Dray, now be quiet. So anyways Omega, (refers to Mystic) how's the weather? *killed* Yeah, I'm done. <_<;;


Oh and to add on to the talk about originality *points to his avatar* I think this is at least original in SOME sense, but people could say otherwise. What I am meaning is in idea wise.
 
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