time gear
Eternity in an hour
I've always just assumed it's because white in terms of light is all of the colors combined. As such, if Sonic flashed colors fast enough he would just look white.
Why does super tails not exist in SRB2?
- Thread starter Bright the Hedgehog YT
- Start date
Bright the Hedgehog YT
Bright the Hedgehog? That's way too far!
I still don't get it
lnferno
Blazing Creator
.... did you actually enable the Lua script? Just making sure. Just dropping it in the addons folder won't activate it.
Julia
The only SRB2 and Touhou fan ever to exist lmao
I think he's referring to the fact he still doesn't understand why Super Tails isn't in Vanilla.
GrayAngel
Member
I think the simplest explanation is that Mystic left the project recently, and he didn't want anyone other than Sonic to be able to go Super. After he left, we got Super Knuckles update almost immediately, just because his programming was ready to go. Now, if we want each of the six playable characters to have unique Super abilities, that will take time. I don't know what the current team has planned, but I expect the only reason Tails, Amy, and Fang don't have Super forms yet is because they're not ready yet.
Pyrakid Wolfo
Member
Another possible reason only Sonic had Super was because maybe Mystic wanted Sonic to be special in being the only one to have a super, giving more of a reason to play as him as he's the worst. Super Metal was snuck in or something. Super Knuckles happened very recently, so its possible the other chars are getting super forms.
time gear
Eternity in an hour
I remember him talking about Sonic being the weakest character before. I disagree with him on the stance that the reason Sonic is "weaker" is because he's not as vertical as the other characters, and therefore takes longer to clear stages. This in my opinion is a problem with the level design, not with Sonic. Tails was the most vertical character in S3K back in the day, but he wasn't always the fastest because the levels were designed more around making use of the spin to go fast, so more often than not it actually took longer to fly over everything than to know what you are doing and just spin. Levels were usually designed more downhill than uphill to take advantage of this. SRB2 is largely very uphill in it's level design, which is why Tails and Knuckles are advantaged. The problem to solve therefore is this: How do you translate that kind of level design and playstyle into SRB2's form of 3D Sonic gameplay?
My opinion on the matter is that super forms are meant to be an overpowered reward for collecting all the emeralds if you so choose to. They are a totally optional, missable extra and should not be the main attraction to playing a character. If being able to go super is the only thing making a character desirable to play as, something is being done wrong.
Novice Speedster
Member
Please notice, that both episodes were sequels to different games.
From what I remember Mystic did make the bad argument that Super Knuckles didn't exist. Based on a later argument he made I don't think he meant it literally at the time, but it happened back around 2010 and at that Time I wound up making 4 how to get super knuckles videos in response to prove him wrong. (How was I suppose to figure out he wasn't being literal about it back then? He wasn't being clear with his argument back then.)
It was in a previous super topic where Mystic made a better argument against super knuckles, but it was too subjective. In that topic he basically argued that when you turned super that there was no longer any difference between any of the characters that went super. When pressed, he then got into more detail saying that after you turn super you wind up ignoring your characters' abilities and just play them exactly the same as super sonic.
To this I responded with 2 more videos. one of the super everyone mod, and the other of playing as Super Sonic and Super knuckles in Sonic 2 and Super everyone in Sonic 3 & Knuckles showing that I was still using the character abilities even while super.
I don't think Mystic was stupid per say. Just that he argued his point badly and that his point was subjective based on how he played the classics.
It was in a previous super topic where Mystic made a better argument against super knuckles, but it was too subjective. In that topic he basically argued that when you turned super that there was no longer any difference between any of the characters that went super. When pressed, he then got into more detail saying that after you turn super you wind up ignoring your characters' abilities and just play them exactly the same as super sonic.
To this I responded with 2 more videos. one of the super everyone mod, and the other of playing as Super Sonic and Super knuckles in Sonic 2 and Super everyone in Sonic 3 & Knuckles showing that I was still using the character abilities even while super.
I don't think Mystic was stupid per say. Just that he argued his point badly and that his point was subjective based on how he played the classics.
GrayAngel
Member
I don't think the "Super makes everyone play the same" argument is very sound, considering the game was designed to give every character the same goal. Get to the end of the level, defeat the boss, with the optional task of collecting emeralds for a "good ending." This isn't Sonic Adventure, where every character gets unique gameplay mechanics, different level layouts, and different goals to complete. Inherently, you're doing the same thing anyway. Every once and a while, you'll get exclusive paths for certain characters, but that's about it. The game isn't designed to make characters a completely different experience to play with.
Chezi
Chili Dogs
if that’s the case, then it’s totally pointless to download mods or play as the other 5 characters. Saying every character has the same goal and that it doesn’t matter if they play the same is a seriously bad opinion. This isn’t Mario Party where everyone has to play the same to keep things straight. This is a Classic Sonic-styled game where everyone has differing abilities to make each run unique and enjoyable. This is why Tails can fly, Knuckles can climb, Amy can use her hammer, Fang can shoot and bounce, and Metal can Dash Mode. It’s so that the game isn’t repetitive. This is why character mods are one of the most exciting things about SRB2: it gives you another way to play the game
GrayAngel
Member
No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that Mystic's broad stroke dismissal of Supers, saying they make all characters play the same, is silly. You can use make similar broad stroke arguments to dismiss the need for alternatives to Sonic at all. They may have different abilities, but they all do the same thing. I remember seeing him argue that once you become Super, all you care about is collect rings to prolong your transformation and rushing through the level. That's oversimplifying things to a ridiculous degree.
Okay, so if he were specifically talking about Amy and Fang (who weren't even playable at the time), I'd understand that argument. When you use mods to go Super with those characters, their weapons do become a bit obsolete. I mean, why both swinging your hammer at enemies when you can just steamroll over them? That could make it seem like it takes away from what makes those characters special. But for Tails, Knuckles, Metal? I don't see how that applies to them.
GrayAngel
Member
Wait. Fang can bounce on water? I knew he could bounce on lava, but had no idea he could do that on water.
Those are some very situational uses for those abilities, though. I barely even use Amy's spring bounce. You can fly, glide, climb, and hover just about anywhere, but Amy's spring bounce can only be used where springs are placed, and they don't always reward it. Fang's bounce is still useful when Super, but his pop gun basically loses its usefulness when Super, since you have to stop to use it.
Wait. What am I doing? I'm arguing for Supers, not against them? lol. The clear solution to this problem is to give Amy and Fang new abilities when Super, so that they still feel unique. Like you could allow Fang to shoot while mobile, with no cooldown between shots. Maybe allow him to fire while in the air as well. Super Amy using her hammer while running could activate a Sonic Adventure style hammer jump. This way, their weapons are still useful.
time gear
Eternity in an hour
I've mentioned it in a previous Supers discussion thread, but I feel that a viable option is to power up Amy and Fang's weapons when they turn super (or instead of Super). Amy's hammer could become jumbo sized like when she's paired with Knuckles in Advance 3, gaining a wider radius on it's attack. Fang could gain the ability to shoot while moving and jumping, lose the cooldown, and cause defeated enemies to explode, damaging nearby enemies. That's one possibility for each, anyway.
In Fang's case, this could be achieved by swapping the gun out for his bike, with the difference in usefulness being because it's a different weapon being used. Perhaps the bike could also have a spring taped to the bottom of it that is used to "power up" his bounce ability? Just spitballing ideas because I love the idea of Fang getting in his bike but wouldn't want it to completely change his playstyle while he's "super".
In Fang's case, this could be achieved by swapping the gun out for his bike, with the difference in usefulness being because it's a different weapon being used. Perhaps the bike could also have a spring taped to the bottom of it that is used to "power up" his bounce ability? Just spitballing ideas because I love the idea of Fang getting in his bike but wouldn't want it to completely change his playstyle while he's "super".
Pyrakid Wolfo
Member
You mean... from Sonic Drift or something? He gets his bike for a super form? Sounds unusual, but uh... if it works it works ig
GrayAngel
Member
Actually, it's from Sonic Triple Trouble on the Game Gear, which was Fang's debut title. He had his own Eggmobile-like vehicle, called the Marvelous Queen. It's referred to as an "airbike," but like Eggman's Eggmobile, it is modular. So in one boss fight, he might have a spring he bounces around on, and in other, he may have a drill on the bottom. He does use the Marvelous Queen in Sonic Drift 2, but that was a callback to Sonic Triple Trouble.
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I like the idea of Hyper Sonic being white with a subtle, multicolored aura. Kinda like this:
I'd give him green eyes instead of red, though. In Sonic 3 & Knuckles, both Super Sonic and Hyper Sonic had green eyes, but now Super has red eyes. Keeping Hyper's green eyes would help differentiate him more from Super, and I just think it looks better with white.
time gear
Eternity in an hour
If modernizing the design of Hyper Sonic were up to me, I'd give him the multicolor aura like in the image GrayAngel posted except almost wrapping around him, with the fur itself having a subtle color flash mixed in with the persistent white. For his eyes, I'd have them be a more vibrant, brighter green with a thin rainbow outline spinning around the green part giving them an almost digital look. The overall impression I'd be going for is the power visibly flowing through his body, rather than radiating off of him.
