What in the world is SRB2 Workshop?

[CILC]

This defeats the purpose of the reusability system in the first place. The idea is to make things easier, to know immediately that you don't even need to ask for permission. I brought up the examples from the other Doom spaces before. In those communities, you have to get explicit permission first, but SRB2 allows you to skip that process if it's marked as reusable.

I include notes clarifying.

I understand you include notes but like. Wouldn’t it be better to have some sort of “contact assets”? Like there might be ppl who would do some really cool shit with what you’ve made that would contact you, you’d be all cool, you’d like what gets made and everyone’s happy, that won’t even approach the subject because it’s tagged as “non reusable” not “contact me first”
What I’m suggesting would still have the ability to know you don’t need to ask permission, but would it not be easier for everyone if there was also something like that as far as “I’m open to it but you gotta ask” to remove interactions of “here’s my cool idea” that never had a chance?

 

[DylanDude]

Nobody is asking questions anymore. I was against closing this thread down at first. Now it's just people throwing insults at each other. Not at all hearing out what others have to say

Most of the issues were caused by one user. The discussion is entirely capable of proceeding respectfully.

Post automatically merged: Sep 25, 2023

I understand you include notes but like. Wouldn’t it be better to have some sort of “contact assets”? Like there might be ppl who would do some really cool shit with what you’ve made that would contact you, you’d be all cool, you’d like what gets made and everyone’s happy, that won’t even approach the subject because it’s tagged as “non reusable” not “contact me first”
What I’m suggesting would still have the ability to know you don’t need to ask permission, but would it not be easier for everyone if there was also something like that as far as “I’m open to it but you gotta ask” to remove interactions of “here’s my cool idea” that never had a chance?

This sounds like a question for staff rather than us. I just use the options put in front of me.

 

[Jisk]

Most of the issues were caused by one user. The discussion is entirely capable of proceeding respectfully.

The only times I have seen this thread in the past few days is people laughing and bickering at screenshots of people from a discord server. And challenging people to insult other people on their mb accounts.

 

[CILC]

Most of the issues were caused by one user. The discussion is entirely capable of proceeding respectfully.

Post automatically merged: Sep 25, 2023

This sounds like a question for staff rather than us. I just use the options put in front of me.

I should prob bring it to staff actually yeah, again my position is more “the system could be improved and I think ppl should reconsider making their mod useable by no one sometimes”

Although I would like to ask out of curiosity, how is it disrespectful to play a port the creator didn’t intend, but not to play a map as a character the creator didn’t intend? I’ve seen lots of ppl say oh it’s just fun but as a designer I feel like thinking one of those is ok and one isn’t is sort of conflicting

 

[C.D. Dinosaur]

I can understand that, but respectfully both a: the reusability system should have a thing essentially saying contact me first (so that someone can’t get permission, work on a mod forever, and then have it revoked)
Like you do understand how that looks right? It doesn’t come across as “just contact me first” it comes across as “don’t reuse this”
And b: I’m talking to specifically the people who set something as non reusable, with the intent of never letting anyone use it ever. Why. Like actually why. No “I put x hours of work in” or anything I want a genuine reason why you think that’s the right thing to do and examples of harm that would be done by not doing that

I feel like this is a good idea on paper but has problems with its ideal execution. Making a mod reusable doesn't mean it'll be learned from and used constructively. When you make an ability reusable, people are more likely to simply slap the ability into their mod rather than deconstruct it and recreate it. I see it as "what would making my mod reusable really do? People will probably just use it to do less work rather than do better work" in a perfect world, It'd be a good idea to make all mods reusable but sometimes it does just feels like people are taking advantage of good will

 

[Mecha-tato]

I have a theory that might explain a LOT.

Spoiler: The reason why hammer head is a pain in the ass

Hammerhead is undercover drunk nintendo

 

[Banjo268]

The only times I have seen this thread in the past few days is people laughing and bickering at screenshots of people from a discord server. And challenging people to insult other people on their mb accounts.

To be fair, I've been fairly calm and respectful in this thread. Yes there is those folks, but all in all, its absolutely important to have this conversation.

 

[CILC]

I feel like this is a good idea on paper but has problems with its ideal execution. Making a mod reusable doesn't mean it'll be learned from and used constructively. When you make an ability reusable, people are more likely to simply slap the ability into their mod rather than deconstruct it and recreate it. I see it as "what would making my mod reusable really do? People will probably just use it to do less work rather than do better work" in a perfect world, It'd be a good idea to make all mods reusable but sometimes it does just feels like people are taking advantage of good will

i can see where ur coming from here, although again that’s specifically why I think the system could use a change to clarify what is “don’t use this” and what is “use this, but actually do something with it, and let me know”
Need to figure out how the staff thingy works

 

[DylanDude]

Although I would like to ask out of curiosity, how is it disrespectful to play a port the creator didn’t intend, but not to play a map as a character the creator didn’t intend? I’ve seen lots of ppl say oh it’s just fun but as a designer I feel like thinking one of those is ok and one isn’t is sort of conflicting

As I said before, publishing edits is the issue, not actually making them. Almost every modder here, when starting out, edited something without permission, they just understood not to publish it. No harm comes from editing something for private use.

The only times I have seen this thread in the past few days is people laughing and bickering at screenshots of people from a discord server. And challenging people to insult people to insult on their mb accounts.

What server would this be?

 

[Steelie]

I understand you include notes but like. Wouldn’t it be better to have some sort of “contact assets”? Like there might be ppl who would do some really cool shit with what you’ve made that would contact you, you’d be all cool, you’d like what gets made and everyone’s happy, that won’t even approach the subject because it’s tagged as “non reusable” not “contact me first”
What I’m suggesting would still have the ability to know you don’t need to ask permission, but would it not be easier for everyone if there was also something like that as far as “I’m open to it but you gotta ask” to remove interactions of “here’s my cool idea” that never had a chance?

From my understanding after reading the submissions and porting guidelines, reusability isn't arbitrarily split to tell you some mods shouldn't be touched, but instead to highlight which mods can be re-used. In this fashion [Non Re-Usable] doesn't mean untouchable, it simply means "ask me if you want to use it".

As for why modders would potentially not want to give permissions, even after asking for them - they may have their own plans with it, or simply want to keep that original work close at heart. It may seem selfish to some folks in the thread, but that's entirely the modders' prerogative, and it's what respecting the artist is all about. They spent hours of their free time working on it, so I think it's only fair they have the final say about it.

 

[CILC]

From my understanding after reading the submissions and porting guidelines, reusability isn't arbitrarily split to tell you some mods shouldn't be touched, but instead to highlight which mods can be re-used. In this fashion [Non Re-Usable] doesn't mean untouchable, it simply means "ask me if you want to use it".

As for why modders would potentially not want to give permissions, even after asking for them - they may have their own plans with it, or simply want to keep that original work close at heart. It may seem selfish to some folks in the thread, but that's entirely their prerogative, and it's where respecting the artist lies. They spent hours of their free time working on it, I feel it's only fair they have the final say about it.

I don’t see how that would be arbitrary, wouldn’t that make it easier for everyone? Lets be real a lot of us aren’t the worlds most social ppl, and I think having the knowledge someone is open to their mod being reused if asked and shown how would ease lots of ppl and encourage more transformative work

Post automatically merged: Sep 25, 2023

As I said before, publishing edits is the issue, not actually making them. Almost every modder here, when starting out, edited something without permission, they just understood not to publish it. No harm comes from editing something for private use.

What server would this be?

is it out of fear that said edits will overtake the original mod or something? And garner criticism?

 

[DylanDude]

is it out of fear that said edits will overtake the original mod or something? And garner criticism?

Uh, no? I don't know where you got that from, with all due respect.

 

[Jisk]

As I said before, publishing edits is the issue, not actually making them. Almost every modder here, when starting out, edited something without permission, they just understood not to publish it. No harm comes from editing something for private use.

What server would this be?

Trash Bin Central (Sandwich faces server). There's people that don't like mb policies that like to insult the people in the thread + staff. People that doent like the mb policies but aren't insulting. People who are in the middle, and people that are fully with the mb and ms' guidelines.
I advise you that the first portion of people are gonna try to attack this thread in any way they can.

 

[CILC]

Uh, no? I don't know where you got that from, with all due respect.

Just a hunch
Again not saying “you’re in the wrong for making a mod non reusable” more “im curious personally why ppl don’t like the idea of anyone publishing something that edits their mod”

 

[Mecha-tato]

NGL I bet that Hammer head is responsible for half of the controversy in this thread

 

[CILC]

Trash Bin Central (Sandwich faces server). There's people that don't like mb policies that like to insult the people in the thread + staff. People that doent like the mb policies but aren't insulting. People who are in the middle, and people that are fully with the mb and ms' guidelines.
I advise you that the first portion of people are gonna try to attack this thread in any way they can.

how are ppl outside of the first group not with the guidelines? Criticizing them doesn’t mean ppl won’t abide by them, unless that’s not what u meant

 

[Mecha-tato]

okay here's the list



just to name a few

What about me?

 

[Steelie]

Just a hunch
Again not saying “you’re in the wrong for making a mod non reusable” more “im curious personally why ppl don’t like the idea of anyone publishing something that edits their mod”

As an artist (even if a small one) I can tell you I would be intensely pissy if anyone took any of my drawings and just drew over them without my permission and posted them somewhere saying "hey look I made this better". Take it with a grain of salt if you wish, but modding is still art and they both go hand in hand.

 

[DylanDude]

Trash Bin Central (Sandwich faces server). There's people that don't like mb policies that like to insult the people in the thread + staff. People that doent like the mb policies but aren't insulting. People who are in the middle, and people that are fully with the mb and ms' guidelines.
I advise you that the first portion of people are gonna try to attack this thread in any way they can.

Then that would be their issue, not ours. If the Workshop defenders/MB critics want to attack people, that would be their choice. But the discussion can otherwise continue as normal.

Saying "They might raid, shut down the thread" would only allow trolls to have exactly what they want.

 

[Banjo268]

You are acting like you are owed the ability to reupload work that isn't yours, or publish edits of it. But that's not true. The creator is the one who did the work, so they get the say, not you. If that means you have to play the addon in a version other than your favorite, then so be it. That's not a major loss.

Yes, but even though the modder "put in x amount of hours", I feel like they should be required a reason to not want a port. Also, this brings a major concern in my opinion: should we consider ports not by the creator a edit? I know that seems like a simple yes, but I feel this should be discussed further.

From my understanding after reading the submissions and porting guidelines, reusability isn't arbitrarily split to tell you some mods shouldn't be touched, but instead to highlight which mods can be re-used. In this fashion [Non Re-Usable] doesn't mean untouchable, it simply means "ask me if you want to use it".

As for why modders would potentially not want to give permissions, even after asking for them - they may have their own plans with it, or simply want to keep that original work close at heart. It may seem selfish to some folks in the thread, but that's entirely their prerogative, and it's where respecting the artist lies.

The first part actually helps clarify anything in the non-reusable section, so thanks for that.
But
If they just wanna keep their og work close to them, why does that stop any fan ports of the mod? I'm genuinely curious.

Trash Bin Central (Sandwich faces server). There's people that don't like mb policies that like to insult the people in the thread + staff. People that doent like the mb policies but aren't insulting. People who are in the middle.
I advise you that the first portion of people are gonna try to attack this thread in any way they can.

I'm definitely don't agree with reusability with SRB2, but I respect it and understand it. As for the first group, just because people disrespect something doesn't mean we raid them. Sandwichface posted on his YT posts that people encouraged raids on his server. It makes me genuinely concerned that some folks in the MB cant discuss with respect for one another.