What in the world is SRB2 Workshop?

[DylanDude]

why are all the moderators so chill with letting dylandude backseat moderate but than ban everybody else that does it?

Such as? Genuinely, if you think I'm backseat moderating, I'd like to know when and where so I can avoid that.

 

[SilverVortex]

my take on this?

you don't need any permission to port a mod, as SRB2 is not an art community, it's a *modding* community, there's no artistic value being put into mods (you could say sprites count, but i really don't, as that also does not make it an """"""""art"""""""" community).
i will treat it as simply a modding community that has bad representatives, same with the Valve community, good community, bad representatives (i will put srb2's community in huge quotations though.

see the thing about modding is that it's an entirely creative process, and anything that has creative intent and effort behind it is indeed art, in turn making modding art. art is not restricted to purely visual mediums, and there's very, very little that you could argue isn't art.

i know its very late to respond to this point, but i don't understand why you'd insist that modding isn't art, even though it's difficult to even define it without using the words "make", "create", or synonyms to such degree.

 

[Tatsuru]

why are all the moderators so chill with letting dylandude backseat moderate but than ban everybody else that does it?

I'm sorry, but where exactly is this happening? I have been watching the discussion for a while and nothing of the sort stood out to me, but if you do have a specific instance you'd like me to review, I'm all ears.

 

[Sls64LGamingBro]

ignoring nintendo's wishes to not use their ip for the reason than "but I want a mario mod" is also a jerk move, but nobody brings that up now do they?


why are all the moderators so chill with letting dylandude backseat moderate but than ban everybody else that does it?

1. Dylandude has tryed to be not like other people who would be a horrible backseat moderaters.

2. C.D. Dinosaur didn't say that at all and clearly was being smart here.

3. All of the moderators might trust about it and sometimes not.

 

[SP Moves Enjoyer]

ignoring nintendo's wishes to not use their ip for the reason than "but I want a mario mod" is also a jerk move, but nobody brings that up now do they?

if Nintendo really cared about it, then they would have the right to do something about it. It doesn't change the fact that making portlegs is disrespecting the original creator

 

[Mecha-tato]

Holy shiitake this is insanely long

 

[C.D. Dinosaur]

ignoring nintendo's wishes to not use their ip for the reason than "but I want a mario mod" is also a jerk move, but nobody brings that up now do they?

First of all, no one likes a corporate shill. Second of all, "IP" and "a complete set of sprites and coding you were specifically instructed not to use" are not the same thing. Third of all, it's not like the blokes at Nintendo taking your fangame down are the same people as the ones who actually make the games or the characters. There is a difference between Leonardo da Vinci telling me not to make my own mona Lisa because it disrespects his work and the Louvre telling me not to make my own mona Lisa because it disrespects their bottom line.

 

[Hammerhead]

I'm sorry, but where exactly is this happening? I have been watching the discussion for a while and nothing of the sort stood out to me, but if you do have a specific instance you'd like me to review, I'm all ears.

it's not just backseat moderating

1. telling someone that they can't shut down the discussion but than saying the mods can't either

"Please ask us first" is not exactly a difficult request to fulfill. I don't think it's us with the issues.

We aren't stopping you from making edits, we are criticizing you for publishing them against the expressed wishes of the artists here. "Please don't reupload my work without permission" is a simple standard followed by artists across the internet. We just call one particular kind of stolen work "portlegs" as community-specific slang.

The issue here is that you don't see mods as art or modders as artists, therefore you don't apply the same level of respect to them as we do.

Post automatically merged: Sep 14, 2023

You do not have a right to shut down discussion. We are having a fine time discussing this, please stop trying to interfere, let alone egotistically insisting everyone thinks you're right when they clearly do not.

Not really. OP's word isn't exactly final either.

2. also acts like he speaks for everyone on mb (note that he keeps on adding the "we" in topics that don't necessarily involve him)

It's true that we shouldn't dismiss all other forums automatically, but that ship has long sailed for the particular forum of relevance.

With all due respect, you don’t make mods, and so don’t have a clear picture of how we feel about our mods. It’s not about the attention for us.

The Workshop is welcome to come and talk things out with us if they so choose. But they haven't. They started this mess by ignoring rules that have been in place for years, rules most of the community has long been fine with. The drama didn't exist before then, so they can come and talk to us when they're done with their self-imposed time out.

You are welcome to continue asking that we stop into the void, but with all due respect, nobody is going to listen. I would advise spending your time elsewhere

Well, it's not a matter of just copyright, but respect for individuals rather than billion-dollar corporations.

We don't care that it's an alternative forum, we care that it's stealing content and boasting about it.

3.also keeps putting workshop and gamebanana in a bad light

Equal in power, I mean. The United States and USSR were the two sole superpowers. There is only one official SRB2 forum, and thus it will always be far more popular than a sideshow run by banned users hosted in a separate hemisphere from most players.

Unauthorized ports and edits have long been looked down upon by the community, it's part of why Gamebanana was so disliked. It's not new. What happened was essentially:

Modders: "We don't want our mods edited without permission."
Workshop: "We just made a space to specifically do that."
Modders: "We don't like that."
Workshop: "That's unfair! Why are you all raising tensions and causing problems. :("

The Workshop directly did something that's long been disliked and is now complaining about being criticized for it. Trying to blame us for this current state of affairs is absurd; the majority of the community supports the modders on this and will continue to do so.

When the Workshop brings its standards up to snuff with the rest of the community (or dies, TBH I don't know which one will transpire first), this drama will subside. But we're not the instigators of the conflict here, so the attempts to blame us fall short of conveying reality.



SSNTails saying something doesn't make it any more true or false. That's an Appeal to Authority fallacy, any argument relying upon it is dead in the water and should be disregarded. Theft is theft, don't defend it.

God I hate searching for comments on forums...

 

[SP Moves Enjoyer]

Im pretty sure dylan dude has been pretty rational when it comes to to his statements, I'm pretty sure a majority of MB users agree with him regardless, and isn't this thread about what the workshop is anyways?

 

[Hammerhead]

Im pretty sure dylan dude has been pretty rational when it comes to to his statements, I'm pretty sure a majority of MB users agree with him regardless, and isn't this thread about what the workshop is anyways?

rational or not it still counts as backseat moderating regardless.

 

[SP Moves Enjoyer]

rational or not it still counts as backseat moderating regardless.

Backseat moderating is when someone tries to enforce the forum rules to people who break them. None of these chat messages you posted go by this.

 

[Hammerhead]

Backseat moderating is when someone tries to enforce the forum rules to people who break them. None of these chat messages you posted go by this.

none of this is backseat moderating to you?

 

[Steelie]

none of this is backseat moderating to you?

No.

Maybe work on your arguments rather than derailing the discussion with pointless accusations.

 

[Hammerhead]

No.

Maybe work on your arguments rather than derailing the discussion with pointless accusations.

maybe explain yours better

 

[SP Moves Enjoyer]

none of this is backseat moderating to you?

The first one is simply telling someone why asking first isn't hard to do, as well as telling you that you can still make edits, but not to post them here, this IS a rule when it comes to submissions, but no one broke it.

The second one is simply telling someone not to shutdown the conversation.

The third one is telling everyone that the OP's word isn't the final one

The fourth one is simply telling everyone not to dismiss other forums and then says that its not relevent to the forum in question (the workshop)

The fifth one is telling someone that they don't make mods, so they can't really tell how other modders feel about it (with respect).

The sixth one is just him saying that the workshop can talk about stuff ig?

The seventh one is telling someone that they should quit asking them to stop (valid thing to say considering the context)

The eight one is saying that we don't care because its a alt forum, more so that its hosting stolen content and then boasting about it (this is true btw)

The ninth one is saying that the MB will always be more popular then the other modding srb2 sites

The tenth one is saying that the workshop is basically doing something that most modders don't like, and then its getting mad that modders don't like it.

where exactly in ANY of these does this show backseat modding?

 

[Tatsuru]

1. telling someone that they can't shut down the discussion but than saying the mods can't either

Informing other users of the forum's rules and about behavior that can or cannot get you banned is not backseat moderating. If he was trying to shut down discussion himself, it could be. I can't tell what you're referring to with "saying the mods can't either".

2. also acts like he speaks for everyone on mb (note that he keeps on adding the "we" in topics that don't necessarily involve him)

That just means he could be wrong by doing so. If being wrong was an offense, half of the people on this thread would've been permabanned by now.

3.also keeps putting workshop and gamebanana in a bad light

Not an offense either. People are allowed to express their opinions about other sites.

I have the feeling you're expecting me to police Dylan's behavior at least as much as I have commented on other people's remarks, but I don't really get why. If you actually witness rule-breaking behavior though, feel free to let me know.

 

[Hammerhead]

never once have i seen workshop boast about it's rules nor it's mods. Nether has gamebanana for that matter

anybody want to actually provide evidence on that?

 

[Steelie]

maybe explain yours better

I don't expect I'd be able to put it better than Tatsuru, so I'll leave it there. I won't know for sure why you decided to throw shade on Dylan like that, but I can probably guess. After all, it is easier to tear the other side of the argument down rather than argue your own point, am I right?

I still can't understand why you guys feel so strongly about the current portleg rules, and the more I'm seeing your side's arguments, the more detached from your point of view I am. There are guidelines in place for if you want to port something. All you need in theory is to get the original author's permission to get it greenlit. And there are also clear guidelines on how to do if if the original author isn't available anymore.
It really comes down to either impatience, or lack of respect. Pick one.

 

[SP Moves Enjoyer]

I don't expect I'd be able to put it better than Tatsuru, so I'll leave it there. I won't know for sure why you decided to throw shade on Dylan like that, but I can probably guess. After all, it is easier to tear the other side of the argument down rather than argue your own point, am I right?

I still can't understand why you guys feel so strongly about the current portleg rules, and the more I'm seeing your side's arguments, the more detached from your point of view I am. There are guidelines in place for if you want to port something. All you need in theory is to get the original author's permission to get it greenlit. And there are also clear guidelines on how to do if if the original author isn't available anymore.
It really comes down to either impatience, or lack of respect. Pick one.

FR, its not even like the rules are strict and you still have people trying to say that permission shouldn't necessary! This is as easy as it gets.

 

[Hammerhead]

I don't expect I'd be able to put it better than Tatsuru, so I'll leave it there. I won't know for sure why you decided to throw shade on Dylan like that, but I can probably guess. After all, it is easier to tear the other side of the argument down rather than argue your own point, am I right?

I still can't understand why you guys feel so strongly about the current portleg rules, and the more I'm seeing your side's arguments, the more detached from your point of view I am. There are guidelines in place for if you want to port something. All you need in theory is to get the original author's permission to get it greenlit. And there are also clear guidelines on how to do if if the original author isn't available anymore.
It really comes down to either impatience, or lack of respect. Pick one.

i have made point VERY clear, it's no different than you guys ostracising workshop users for having different rules than the mb