2.1 Techno Hill

[Sapheros]

While I agree that the slime might be a BIT (keyword a BIT) too punishing should you mess up in particular ways, wasting your time and killing your flow is actually the intended punishment for failing to play correctly around the slime. I'd like to remind everyone that SRB2 is not "gotta go fast", it's intended to operate like the classics, where playing through quickly and with good flow requires practice and some memorization of the stage layout. Your first few times playing through classic Sonic, you weren't going through with epic flow and looking awesome; you were stopping dead constantly, getting hit, and otherwise messing up in ways that caused you to slow down dramatically.

With this new slime, your first few times you deal with the slime, you're expected to mess up and in the process of messing up learn the mechanics and figure out methods of dealing with the slime more efficiently. Going quickly through the slime requires practice and mastery of the controls, and that's a good thing! Your reward for practice is getting to feel awesome at something you previously sucked at, and that's the hallmark of a good gimmick as far as I'm concerned.

I fully agree with Mystic here. THZ (other than it's amazing changes) isn't that hard. it would feel long in the beginning because of the slime. But as you will see, the game EXPECTS you to use the slime wisely, to get tokens, progress the level, and to learn it's mechanic.

I will also agree with everyone that the slime IS slow, in which the only problem of recovery takes too long and falling in it as certain characters will cost lots of delays, especially in racing (Imagine Knuckles having to fall into the slime after a long fall from a gli- oh wait, that CAN happen). But it does take some practice, if you complete the game and replay it or even play it in multiplayer, you'll quickly get used to the levels' design and even try new tricks yourself, like getting the underground token in THZ1 or trying to get the Armageddon shield at the beginning of the zone. Trust me, replay THZ 1 and 2 right now and take your time to try some cool speed run tricks. (Disclaimer: Results may vary, if there aren't any speed run tricks, don't take my word)

 

[GameKyuubi]

I agree, this is kind of a delicate thing because its use doubles as a punishment and an exploration tool, so movement should slow down while walking on it or moving in it, but it's just so frustrating to watch Sonic bob up and down next to a ledge while you wait to get your jump back. THIS is the real issue as far as I'm concerned: the situation where you're already where you need to be but you're just waiting for the game to give you your controls back so you can continue.

Though maybe that's the heart of the issue here. It's trying to be both an exploration tool and a punishment, which can make exploration feel ... well, punishing or frustrating.

 

[clairebun]

While I agree that the slime might be a BIT (keyword a BIT) too punishing should you mess up in particular ways, wasting your time and killing your flow is actually the intended punishment for failing to play correctly around the slime.

Forcing wait times is not a good punishment. Slowing the gameplay down itself is fine.

 

[Kaysakado]

Maybe the paths back out of the slime could have ramps leading out to them. So you could sort of "beach" yourself back onto land instead of having to wait to regain control and jump up.

EDIT: check it out, https://www.mediafire.com/?63do3la523wzw2z first slime pool in THZ1. Something like that, but more cleanly implemented?

 

[Knuckles MetalMind]

I personally love THZ 2.1 (specially Act2), and I already loved 2.0 one. I understand the stage may feel long on the first playthroughs, but I certainly enjoyed every bit of the zone and it´s not that long once you now the layout. There aren´t that many deadly hazards on the entire zone, so it´s a matter of learning the gimmicks and getting to the end. It´s a great learning level IMO for beginners, as there´s plenty to do and not much to lose (except time).


The new slime felt awkward at first, but it´s one of the funniest gimmicks for me now. In fact, I think it´s underused and I think there could be some more paths / puzzles around it that just falling from an high place. It´s strange that there´s no underground tunnel in the slime. Some other objects, like springs or pushable objects, could use it a little more. And yeah, sometimes is a pain having time punishment VS damage punishment, but I feel it works better this way for a 2nd stage, and I wouldn´t ever go back to the damaging slime.


From all 2.1 stages, the one I keep remembering more after days without playing the game is THZ2, just like ERZ and ACZ made me go back to the game when they were released.

 

[Monster Iestyn]

To the OP who made this thread: it's "SRB2 2.1", not "SRB 2.1".

 

[GameKyuubi]

To the OP who made this thread: it's "SRB2 2.1", not "SRB 2.1".

Thanks for the correction. I have fixed the error in my thread title.

 

[Agustin1216]

It's so hard?
Take a look at this:

Spoiler

The unstoppable... WALKTHROUGH OF THZ2!

PD: It's not Teal, it's Cyan! You'll never see me using other color rather than Cyan!
If it looks like Teal, it's because i use this palette

 

[GameKyuubi]

I don't think anyone's saying the level is hard.

 

[Espyo]

IMO, the slime is a great mechanic. You need to be smart and skilled to use it well, and if you use it wrong, nothing really bad happens to you. Easy to get into, and hard to master, if I can put it like that.

My main gripe is how slow everything is. Whether you're exploring, trying to reach a specific spot, or trying to play normally, the goop is just painfully slow. If I'm trying to reach an emblem where you have to dive deep, I go for the jump, I fall in, I aim myself carefully. If I miss, it's ok, I'll try again, it's my fault. The problem comes after missing: I'll just go take a quick piss while I wait for my character to emerge from the goop...
...All right, they're coming out of the goop. Now let me just orient myself so I can land on a platform and try again... Oh, I missed. Well, let me just cook and eat my lunch, and when I come back, MAYBE the character will have stopped bouncing on the goop.

Honestly, I just can't have a good vertical or horizontal control when I'm trying to get out. I've read the devs write on this thread that you get full horizontal speed. Either I must've jammed a screwdriver on my fingers, or I have a version that doesn't allow you to go very fast horizontally. As for vertically, you rise too slowly. That's definitely my main problem. And should you fail your jump, you sink again, and after forever, you stand on the surface. If the buoyancy while under the goop were increased (though balanced so that you don't go higher than you should), I think it'd solve everything. You wouldn't die of boredom waiting for your character to get out, should it go in, and once it did, it wouldn't bounce back and forth for 8 minutes until you finally get to do your thing under proper control again.

Just my two cents...