Do you prefer Techno Legacy or Final Demo?

[A_Different_Name]

While many might say Final Demo is just Techno Legacy but better, I'd actually argue otherwise.

I'm personally much more of a fan of Techno Legacy than Final Demo as a stage. The main issue I have with FDZ is that, aside from Techno Hill Act 2, none of the older stages I feel really deserve to be here? Personally, I feel Greenflower Zone and Techno Hill Act 1 are too similar to their final version aside from their lower quality and Castle Eggman Acts 1 & 2 are just... not fun.
Not saying TLZ/Old THZ1 are works of art either, I just feel like none of the other stages- maybe aside from Old RVZ -deserve to be in the final game. I personally would've been fine if the Final Demo remake/port just stayed as an addon.
To put credit where credit is due, I find the method you access RHZ to be really charming (Even if a little difficult to get to as Amy. I did do it though~!) and the cameo of Ugly Knux is especially cute. One of my favorite things to do with him is have one of the Jetty-Syns shoot and kill him to end the stage lol.

tl;dr, I prefer Techno Legacy Zone over Final Demo Zone

Though, all of that being said, I'd love to hear your thoughts on the matter. Do you prefer having all the Final Demo stages or would you prefer just Techno Legacy? Do you think Techo Legacy being replaced was deserved?

 

[Julia]

Oh, I think Techno Legacy being replaced was totally justified.

As cool as it was to have what is basically a 2.1 indev stage in the game (considering that it ISN'T the 2.0 version of the stage, since there's differences like missing enemies and the like), it was arguably the game's worst unlockable stage, the fact it was half of the 100 emblem reward makes it even worse. Final Demo Zone is much better as an unlockable and as a stage that's supposed to represent the game's history. Sure, it's a bit long, and some of those level portions aren't the best, but that's what being old with different standards does to those stages. It's a look back on the game during 2003-2006, over 20 years ago at the time FDZ was added.

Personally, despite old CEZ's faults, I still like it. I like the idea of CEZ2, not so much the execution, but a shakeup like it would be cool to see return.

So yeah, TLZ being replaced, at least I think, was long overdue, and I'm glad we didn't have to wait for 2.3 to do it.

 

[A_Different_Name]

As cool as it was to have what is basically a 2.1 indev stage in the game (considering that it ISN'T the 2.0 version of the stage, since there's differences like missing enemies and the like), it was arguably the game's worst unlockable stage, the fact it was half of the 100 emblem reward makes it even worse. Final Demo Zone is much better as an unlockable and as a stage that's supposed to represent the game's history. Sure, it's a bit long, and some of those level portions aren't the best, but that's what being old with different standards does to those stages. It's a look back on the game during 2003-2006, over 20 years ago at the time FDZ was added.

That is actually a really good point. Kinda why I said "as a stage", too. I'll admit, when I first unlocked Techno Legacy and cleared it, I sat there and said...

"That's it. That's the secret level? THAT STAGE WASN'T EVEN A MINUET LONG!! SONIC TEAM JR BETRAYED US!!!"/ref

 

[time gear]

Personally, I feel Greenflower Zone and Techno Hill Act 1 are too similar to their final version aside from their lower quality

This isn't the point. It's not about being different or quality, it's about the Final Demo era's legacy. The final demo versions in particular are a very iconic period from SRB2's development, and preserving it in some form in the latest version is the entire point. There are some differences, such as the enemies using their newer sprites and the shields being their updated versions, but aside from that it's a very good and faithful recreation of the zones minus the bosses. You could think of it as a sort of museum exhibit showing off what SRB2 used to be like. A sort of "SRB2 The Past Lite" if you will. Techno Legacy was a rather unfaithful recreation of Final Demo THZ2, so aside from alienating short level and green acid enthusiasts FDZ is a straight upgrade in every regard. I'd even argue that being so unfaithful is what makes TLZ less deserving of an official inclusion, and more deserving of being a standalone addon.

and Castle Eggman Acts 1 & 2 are just... not fun.

That's subjective. I've always found them to be very fun, and in fact I even like the button hunt aspects. You could say that once you've memorized a pathway to complete the level quickly and committed it to muscle memory that it becomes rather mindless, but the same goes for any stage really. I've always loved how open the Final Demo version of CEZ2 feels in particular, the design allows you to complete the various challenges in the level in whatever order you wish and there's a bunch of hidden little side paths for you to find goodies in if you're not rushing to the goal, plus ample opportunities to get a bunch of 1-ups.

I just feel like none of the other stages- maybe aside from Old RVZ -deserve to be in the final game.

The legacy of these stages is what makes them deserving. You might not have been around back then and so you might not get it, but this was a very special period of time in SRB2's history and Final Demo Zone serves as a sort of memorial of it. For those of us who were around back then it's nostalgic, and for those who are newer to the game it's a glimpse back to a simpler time when the main campaign was only three zones and we had fewer enemy types and no slopes.

Personally I adore Final Demo Zone and I hope we could get similar unlockables for other stages such as the other various redesigns of CEZ, As special as the Final Demo era was, I don't think we should ignore the legacy of versions such as the 1.0 and 2.0 versions, though they need not be all in one stages FDZ style.

 

[JABSphere94]

While I miss Techno Legacy Zone's green goop I prefer Final Demo Zone, I just wished they'd replace ugly knuckles with a sign post so the map doesn't become a complete waste of time in race

 

[A_Different_Name]

Personally I adore Final Demo Zone and I hope we could get similar unlockables for other stages such as the other various redesigns of CEZ, As special as the Final Demo era was, I don't think we should ignore the legacy of versions such as the 1.0 and 2.0 versions, though they need not be all in one stages FDZ style.

Admittedly I did write this post late at night, but that is still a good point. Again, kinda why I mentioned liking TLZ as a stage. While I didn't mention it in my main post, I did acknowledge that in terms of showing off SRB2's history and- later on, as Julia mentioned -being an unlockable, Final Demo Zone is just better in every single way.

Personally, I think its really just the Castle Eggman sections that kinda bog the stage down. It's not even the switch hunting that bothers me. It's mainly just the tight hallways in Act 1 that mess with the camera (Though I suppose you could just use first person in retrospect lol) and the large number of Crawlas in Act 2; especially since sometimes when you first load into an act, enemies will be swarming the spawn. This happens primarily in THZ2 (Although sometimes the opposite will happen where the Crawla Commander is missing), CEZ3 and, you guessed it, CEZ2.
Though if you've collected enough emblems to get FDZ, you'll more than likely just have the rings to tank the ambushes... Or just go through RVZ and grab all the Chaos Emeralds to turn super.

 

[time gear]

It's mainly just the tight hallways in Act 1 that mess with the camera

I don't have an issue with this, though I also play with the automatic playstyle while using my controller.

and the large number of Crawlas in Act 2

This is because at the time the act was created, we only had a few different enemy types. Crawlas, Jetty-syns, and Buzzers was all there really was for the most part. There were a few other enemies that were more context sensitive such as Detons, but for the most part it was very much an era of Crawla and Buzzer spam. If the purpose of the project was to take the old level design and spruce it up to modern standards, the number of Crawlas would certainly be toned down by replacing them with other enemies. However, that's not what this is meant to be.

As for why there's so many to begin with, that's because they're there for lives farming. There's an armageddon shield you can find in the level and there's a bunch of different places for you to choose to detonate it depending on how many Crawla's you've already defeated in the various areas and how patient you are at corralling groups of them together into one place. You can also do bounce chains on them to farm 1-ups as well, in addition to the 1-ups hidden throughout the level.

Again though, quality isn't the point. It's a faithful recreation of the stages as they were in the Final Demo era, and acts as a way of preserving that legacy in an updated version of the game. As an old veteran from back in the day myself, something I've had immense pleasure from is playing through these old levels with modern addons enabled that far exceed what was possible back in the day. Playing as HMS also serves as some pretty great JTE.exe nostalgia (If you know, you know).

 

[Mr Beagle]

The historical value of Final Demo Zone is definitely well above that of Techno Legacy, and it also contains a better-quality port of the latter as well.

I am not sure what the code for Uglyknux did that broke custom assets in nearly every addon, but it shouldn't be that difficult to close out the 2.2.x series with the zone included.