The sequel to s_fawfulpack!

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Fawfulfan

Fawfulfan

The Tortured Planet guy
This new four-pack of levels is, I believe, a big improvement over the previous level pack. Sorry, no screenshots. The levels are, in order:

Bowser's Castle Zone
Wacky Tesseract Zone
Frost Flare Zone
Nowhere Zone

BE WARNED!!! These levels are EXTREMELY challenging!!!!!
Download them at http://srb2ffh.supersanctuary.net/243s_fawfulpack2.wad
I eagerly await your complaints and/or compliments.[/url]
 
Looks like you know the basics of level designing, and even some somewhat advanced stuff. Though I played the thing through until Wacky Tesseract zone, and found that there were parts that are unplayable. I got frustrated and ran through the level in god mode. There's lots of super cramped passageways, and your rings aren't deafed (they don't float). Also lots of tiny floating and crumbling platforms over huge deathpits. I thought it would get better once I got to Frost Flare zone. I saw a lot of potentially good things that was in the level, and a lot of good looking parts. But like the last level, there were small platforms, gigantically frustrating parts, and unavoidable dangers, and that's bad. I quit the level (even though I played some parts in god mode) because I just think it's plain unplayable.

I took the liberty of taking some screenshots.
srb20005-4.png

srb20006-2.png

srb20007-3.png

This part completely sucked:
srb20009-1.png

srb20010.png


Sometimes, challenging isn't a good thing. If you aim for super challenging, you usually get an unplayable level.
 
There's nothing wrong with challenging, but it's the structure of the challenges that counts. As long as you have a steady difficulty slope (and your level design allows the player to make choices), your levels should generally be alright.

However, also know that there's a difference between fun hard and stupid hard. If you have a level in which the player is constantly trying to outrace a rising pit of acid and introduce newer and more difficult obstacles throughout the level, you'll get a hard level, but you'll get a fun one too. If you have tiny platforms over a deathpit that the player must get across and use that as a common gimmick in your levels, that isn't fun -- that's just annoying.


I haven't tried out the levels yet, but I'll consider doing so in a bit.
 
Here's a few:
People who don't know these are here will probably get crushed:
srb20016-1.png


3/4 doors will kill you, you have to guess which one won't.
srb20017-1.png


Looks safe to jump:
srb20018.png


A moment later:
srb20019.png
 
Forgive me for being literal here, but none of those are IMPOSSIBLE to avoid. In fact, I'm quite proud of that last one. Sure, you die the first few times, because you don't know the trick, but you figure it out eventually.
 
Not even the sharpest of reflexes could avoid some of these. You have to put some kind of warning for things like this. Also, take into consideration that some of us like playing on ultimate all the time. Those of us do not have the luxury of the try and fail type of obstacles you put in.
The Wiki said:
Don’t create unavoidable hazards. Make sure that if the player doesn’t know about a trap or hazard and triggers it, it’s still possible to avoid taking damage.
Click to expand...
 
Well, all the examples you cited are avoidable. I've gotten past all of them without taking damage several times. As far as I know, the only obstacle that is pretty much completely unavoidable was the swarm of Detons in Wacky Tesseract Zone.

By the way, on Frost Flare Zone, in the part you were talking about, there is a shatter block in the wall of the first room that covers a secret passage allowing you to skip that hallway.
 
fawfulfan said:
Well, all the examples you cited are avoidable. I've gotten past all of them without taking damage several times. As far as I know, the only obstacle that is pretty much completely unavoidable was the swarm of Detons in Wacky Tesseract Zone.

By the way, on Frost Flare Zone, in the part you were talking about, there is a shatter block in the wall of the first room that covers a secret passage allowing you to skip that hallway.
Click to expand...

From what I have read, your opinions, from you developing these levels yourself, are biased.

The only reason you have no trouble with getting past these obstacles is because you know how they work - you are the one that made these traps, so of course you'd know how to get past them.
 
Well, it's hard not to be a little biased. I would think that skilled players would figure them out relatively quickly, but I guess I did make them a bit too tough. Let me say, though, that I always play a level through to make sure it's not impossible.
 
I'm trying to help you improve your maps fawfulfan, how the hell do you expect to improve the maps if you deflect, persist, and resist against criticism? You shouldn't have to die to learn that a danger is there, this especially applies to people that have no lives left.
 
fawfulfan said:
Well, it's hard not to be a little biased. I would think that skilled players would figure them out relatively quickly, but I guess I did make them a bit too tough. Let me say, though, that I always play a level through to make sure it's not impossible.
Click to expand...


Dying due to a cheaply placed trap is a bit irritating, even to the skilled player.
The traps aren't impossible (to someone who knows them i.e. you), but people don't expect to be normally stopped completely by one trap (and who aren't even given a clue as to pass it).

And you playing through a level to see if it's impossible, is wasted time on your effort. You know all of the traps and where they are, how can you see if it's too difficult for the unknowing player?
 
Sorry. I don't mean to resist all of your criticism. I actually agree that it's too hard, and that the dangers are hard to spot until it's too late. It's only that it's difficult for me NOT to make my maps insanely difficult. The next time I release levels, the dangers will be much easier to spot. Still, you may not want to play my subsequent releases on ultimate.
 
I'll be reviewing Frost Flare, since I was actually quite impressed with it. I used console to get there, but, anyway...

This map could have been really cool. One of the things this map really lacked was Rings. The ceiling spikes and the steam was a very neat idea, actually. Make that area less cramped, and don't do the two steam+spikes right in a row one, please. I never got hit by it, but if the steam actually went as wide as the pipe, I would have.

The hidden crumbling ice platform was a bad idea, too.

The crushers are REALLY cheap, and I don't want to plunge into a laser immediately, either. The turret...well, never surprised me, which was good. It was quite well-executed. I also want the barrel platforms to be bigger, i.e., make larger clusters. The Instant Kill sector is the farthest I ever got, and that was an absolutely terrible idea.

More Star Posts, please.

EDIT: Cheating to get past that part revealed that the rest of the stage has horrid design.
 
What did you think of the second factory section?

P.S. the Instant Kill sector was only on the blue grid. The yellow grid was a regular Death Pit. Or did you already know that?
 
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