What are your opinions on the Genesis games (Sonic 1, Sonic 2, Sonic 3 & Knuckles)? I think S3K is the best out of all of them, with Sonic 2 as a close second.
Strongest entry in the Genesis era?
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TheDoctor
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Sonic 1 was a bit slow paced, it was great though. Levels like StarLight, and Green Hill made the game very fun.
Sonic 2 was better, alot better, I personally loved this game. I played the original version, AND the prototypes with Hidden Palace in it and stuff (mind you, Hidden Palace = fun)
Sonic 3, was actually the first one I disliked. And the reason for this, is for the sole purpose of Angel Island. I HATE that level. It is extremely slow paced, excluding that one part where you literally press and hold right... All the other levels were great however, but the first level makes me purly dislike the game.
It was until I got the Sonic & Knuckles prototype, that I loved the game. Since the zone selection option was still implemented. The only difference between the latest prototype and the original, is a few graphical errors with Tails and Spikes when exiting a Special Stage. So, S3&K prototype = amazing, and no more Angel Island :D.
So, all in all, I say the the S3&K Prototype is the best, but if its about the final versions, I say Sonic 2.
(A little offtopic, I highly recommend for people to play "Classic Sonic Heroes", its a hack that uses everything from Sonic 3, but has all the levels from Sonic 1 and Sonic 2. The game has the ability to switch characters during gameplay, so you could be speeding down green hill zone with sonic, climb the walls of the pit you fell into with knuckles, and fly to the goal as tails :P. It also has 14 special stages, 7 from Sonic 1, 7 from Sonic 2. Collect 7 chaos emeralds to turn to Super Sonic, Super Tails, and Super Knuckles, and collect 7 Sol emeralds to turn to Hyper Sonic, Super Tails, and Super Knuckles.)
Sonic 2 was better, alot better, I personally loved this game. I played the original version, AND the prototypes with Hidden Palace in it and stuff (mind you, Hidden Palace = fun)
Sonic 3, was actually the first one I disliked. And the reason for this, is for the sole purpose of Angel Island. I HATE that level. It is extremely slow paced, excluding that one part where you literally press and hold right... All the other levels were great however, but the first level makes me purly dislike the game.
It was until I got the Sonic & Knuckles prototype, that I loved the game. Since the zone selection option was still implemented. The only difference between the latest prototype and the original, is a few graphical errors with Tails and Spikes when exiting a Special Stage. So, S3&K prototype = amazing, and no more Angel Island :D.
So, all in all, I say the the S3&K Prototype is the best, but if its about the final versions, I say Sonic 2.
(A little offtopic, I highly recommend for people to play "Classic Sonic Heroes", its a hack that uses everything from Sonic 3, but has all the levels from Sonic 1 and Sonic 2. The game has the ability to switch characters during gameplay, so you could be speeding down green hill zone with sonic, climb the walls of the pit you fell into with knuckles, and fly to the goal as tails :P. It also has 14 special stages, 7 from Sonic 1, 7 from Sonic 2. Collect 7 chaos emeralds to turn to Super Sonic, Super Tails, and Super Knuckles, and collect 7 Sol emeralds to turn to Hyper Sonic, Super Tails, and Super Knuckles.)
Half of Sonic 1 feels sluggish, repetitive, and unnecessarily linear. It loses by a landslide.
Sonic 2 fixes pretty much all of those issues. It's just as simple as Sonic 1 but has a lot more replayability. Nearly every zone is clean, memorable, and well-paced; the difficulty curve and length leads to a more engaging experience. The only problem are the special stages, which turn into pure memorization by stage 6, and some of the enemy placements are pure bullshit no matter how careful you try to be.
Sonic 3&K expands on the original formula extremely well, it has the best special stages and a hell of a lot of content to offer, but it suffers from an over-reliance on pace-breaking gimmicks for plenty of the earlier zones. It's also substantially less difficult, I've noticed. In my mind, 3&K is probably the best Sonic game, but I feel Sonic 2 is a very close second because it keeps things simple and does it right for the most part. It's also better fit around lack of save games, which is a huge appeal to me.
Sonic 2 fixes pretty much all of those issues. It's just as simple as Sonic 1 but has a lot more replayability. Nearly every zone is clean, memorable, and well-paced; the difficulty curve and length leads to a more engaging experience. The only problem are the special stages, which turn into pure memorization by stage 6, and some of the enemy placements are pure bullshit no matter how careful you try to be.
Sonic 3&K expands on the original formula extremely well, it has the best special stages and a hell of a lot of content to offer, but it suffers from an over-reliance on pace-breaking gimmicks for plenty of the earlier zones. It's also substantially less difficult, I've noticed. In my mind, 3&K is probably the best Sonic game, but I feel Sonic 2 is a very close second because it keeps things simple and does it right for the most part. It's also better fit around lack of save games, which is a huge appeal to me.
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I think Sonic 1 and 2 are garbage.
Sonic 1 has the most awful difficulty spikes in existence. One minute you get the fast and fun Green Hill Zone, and the next you get the incredibly slow-paced platforming emphasizing Marble Zone, and then it goes to Spring Yard Zone, which is a mix of the two, but is generally easier than Marble. The difficulty should start low with GHZ and slowly begin to get harder instead of the awful spike straight at Marble. Some of the level design in Sonic 1 is also quite dickish, and makes you wonder what mastermind decided to fuel rage into the hearts of many. Not to mention there's no save system, or continues, and the special stages are the trippiest thing ever when you spend a while playing them.
As for Sonic 2, the level design is bad, it has zones for the sake of having zones(was Oil Ocean necessary?) and does have good music, but some of it isn't as good as Sonic 1's, not to mention the change in music for Hidden Palace. Hell, even the "remastered" Hidden Palace suffers from the same design issues that the rest of the game suffers from. In terms of difficulty spikes, they're nowhere near as harsh as in Sonic 1, and the reward for collecting all of the emeralds is wonderful. The bosses are much more entertaining to fight, although some of them are just too damned hard compared to other ones in the game(Death Egg Zone, I'm talking about you) and have put me into endless save file reload loops due to running out of lives. It must be miraculous how people were able to play this game without a save system o_O.
Sonic 3 & Knuckles on the other hand is absolutely wonderful. You get three different characters to choose from, each with their own special routes to explore in levels and unique abilities, loads of awesome power ups(flame, bubble, and electric shields!), much better level design than in the first two games, a wider(and better) range of zones to run through, much more replay value, and finally a save system. Along with this, S3&K has the best soundtrack out of all three of these games, with tons of incredibly memorable tracks. This game also fixes the issue of awful Special Stages in Sonic games with the sheer amount of them you can enter. In just about every level, there's more than one special stage ring, and there's over ten zones, so that's plenty of time to get every Chaos Emerald. With that being said, there's also the fact that the other two characters also have super forms, so they aren't left out. If that isn't enough power, you've also got the super emeralds, which are... insane.
Aside from that, if Sonic CD was included in this, it would be a close second to Sonic 3.
Sonic 1 has the most awful difficulty spikes in existence. One minute you get the fast and fun Green Hill Zone, and the next you get the incredibly slow-paced platforming emphasizing Marble Zone, and then it goes to Spring Yard Zone, which is a mix of the two, but is generally easier than Marble. The difficulty should start low with GHZ and slowly begin to get harder instead of the awful spike straight at Marble. Some of the level design in Sonic 1 is also quite dickish, and makes you wonder what mastermind decided to fuel rage into the hearts of many. Not to mention there's no save system, or continues, and the special stages are the trippiest thing ever when you spend a while playing them.
As for Sonic 2, the level design is bad, it has zones for the sake of having zones(was Oil Ocean necessary?) and does have good music, but some of it isn't as good as Sonic 1's, not to mention the change in music for Hidden Palace. Hell, even the "remastered" Hidden Palace suffers from the same design issues that the rest of the game suffers from. In terms of difficulty spikes, they're nowhere near as harsh as in Sonic 1, and the reward for collecting all of the emeralds is wonderful. The bosses are much more entertaining to fight, although some of them are just too damned hard compared to other ones in the game(Death Egg Zone, I'm talking about you) and have put me into endless save file reload loops due to running out of lives. It must be miraculous how people were able to play this game without a save system o_O.
Sonic 3 & Knuckles on the other hand is absolutely wonderful. You get three different characters to choose from, each with their own special routes to explore in levels and unique abilities, loads of awesome power ups(flame, bubble, and electric shields!), much better level design than in the first two games, a wider(and better) range of zones to run through, much more replay value, and finally a save system. Along with this, S3&K has the best soundtrack out of all three of these games, with tons of incredibly memorable tracks. This game also fixes the issue of awful Special Stages in Sonic games with the sheer amount of them you can enter. In just about every level, there's more than one special stage ring, and there's over ten zones, so that's plenty of time to get every Chaos Emerald. With that being said, there's also the fact that the other two characters also have super forms, so they aren't left out. If that isn't enough power, you've also got the super emeralds, which are... insane.
Aside from that, if Sonic CD was included in this, it would be a close second to Sonic 3.
Wombatwarlord777
"...What?"
In my opinion, they all have different strengths. Sonic 3 and Knuckles is my favorite because it combines very good platforming with the best aesthetics the Genesis Sonic games had to offer, as well as a good story that can be conveyed in simple cut-scenes. Lastly, it has three characters who can fully utilitize their unique skills in order to navigate different parts of a level.
Sonic 2 handles a lot more smoothly than the other games and, for the most part, the levels are the most optimally oriented towards flow and speed-runs. Unlike Sonic 3 and Knuckles, the level design features large stretches of level that are oriented horizontally, so that it becomes a matter of the player expertly hopping, spinning, and using gimmicks. Also, my favorite Special Stages of the Genesis era are the ones in this game.
Sonic 1 is an odd bird. It's a lot slower and more tedious than the other two games. But in that sense, it operates a lot more like the old platformers of the NES era, many of which were notoriously difficult. So if I want a challenge, I pop in Sonic 1. Also, although I like Sonic 3's looks and sounds better, there's something oddly appealing about Sonic 1 in a different, unrefined way. The entire thing has a whimsical, almost alien vibe to it that I definitely appreciate. I suppose the melancholic music of Green Hill and the entirety of the Special Stages can best capture what I'm trying describe.
Sonic 2 handles a lot more smoothly than the other games and, for the most part, the levels are the most optimally oriented towards flow and speed-runs. Unlike Sonic 3 and Knuckles, the level design features large stretches of level that are oriented horizontally, so that it becomes a matter of the player expertly hopping, spinning, and using gimmicks. Also, my favorite Special Stages of the Genesis era are the ones in this game.
Sonic 1 is an odd bird. It's a lot slower and more tedious than the other two games. But in that sense, it operates a lot more like the old platformers of the NES era, many of which were notoriously difficult. So if I want a challenge, I pop in Sonic 1. Also, although I like Sonic 3's looks and sounds better, there's something oddly appealing about Sonic 1 in a different, unrefined way. The entire thing has a whimsical, almost alien vibe to it that I definitely appreciate. I suppose the melancholic music of Green Hill and the entirety of the Special Stages can best capture what I'm trying describe.
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Sure, let's include it. CD was okay, but the spindash was broken IMO. The camera features made up for it though.
Wombatwarlord777
"...What?"
Sonic CD is my least favorite of the early-era Sonic games. I suppose that the word that would encapsulate my opinion of it is "inconsistant". The music from both soundtracks is excellent (if sometimes repetitive), but the art swings from either being as great as that as Sonic 3 and Knuckles to being garish. I appreciate what the game attempts to do in encouraging the player to explore the level in order to find the robot generator in the past, but actually getting there from the present can be a pain. There's absolutely no reason to go to the future at all (except maybe weaker badniks; there really needs to be an alternative way to obtain the good ending!). Also, the Special Stages can be a freaking nightmare that overly rely on popping and popping again that blue time-extending UFO!
That said, I still think it's a perfectly serviceable, if perhaps unorthodox, Sonic game.
That said, I still think it's a perfectly serviceable, if perhaps unorthodox, Sonic game.
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Honestly, my favorite of all the Genesis/MD Sonic games is Sonic 3 & Knuckles, though 2 is a close second for me. I always thought S3&K was better thanks to a really cool soundtrack, cool stages, and even some little cutscenes here and there telling the game's story. And the special stages are some of the best in the whole series, IMO. Oh yeah, and the save feature. Whoever decided to put that into S3&K should get a medal.
As for the rest... S2 was really nice, but it didn't have all the little things that made S3&K a masterpiece (like a save feature). That being said, S2 is good for just being raw: flying through stages with Sonic's spindash is always satisfying. The soundtrack is good, but some of the stages can be a tad... meh... Special stages are kinda cool, though. Still, it's pretty nice, though you're going to be playing it a long time if you want to beat it.
S1 feels kinda slow and really hard in comparison. That being said, it does have its moments; like S2, some of the stages can be a bit bland but, for the most part, they're alright. I'd argue that the soundtrack is ever so slightly better than S2's, but that's just me. And those special stages... O_O They are trippy as heck. And no spindash, like in every game after this. I nearly guarantee it was some lunatic's dream when S1 was being designed. All that being said, I'd play S1 if you really want a good challenge from a Sonic game.
Sonic CD is a really odd beast, IMO. For one thing, you've got that time travel system in place and having to go back to the past in order to destroy robot generators can be somewhat of a pain. The soundtracks are really nice, if somewhat repetitive, and the stages themselves aren't that bad. The special stages though... I dunno. This game's alright.
As for the rest... S2 was really nice, but it didn't have all the little things that made S3&K a masterpiece (like a save feature). That being said, S2 is good for just being raw: flying through stages with Sonic's spindash is always satisfying. The soundtrack is good, but some of the stages can be a tad... meh... Special stages are kinda cool, though. Still, it's pretty nice, though you're going to be playing it a long time if you want to beat it.
S1 feels kinda slow and really hard in comparison. That being said, it does have its moments; like S2, some of the stages can be a bit bland but, for the most part, they're alright. I'd argue that the soundtrack is ever so slightly better than S2's, but that's just me. And those special stages... O_O They are trippy as heck. And no spindash, like in every game after this. I nearly guarantee it was some lunatic's dream when S1 was being designed. All that being said, I'd play S1 if you really want a good challenge from a Sonic game.
Sonic CD is a really odd beast, IMO. For one thing, you've got that time travel system in place and having to go back to the past in order to destroy robot generators can be somewhat of a pain. The soundtracks are really nice, if somewhat repetitive, and the stages themselves aren't that bad. The special stages though... I dunno. This game's alright.
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As far as Megadrive Sonic games ago, I'd say Sonic 3 & Knuckles is by far my favourite one for the consistently high quality of the level design and how visually it still holds up as looking quite nice even today in my opinion. Not to mention the funky soundtrack and just how, even today, I find it a fun game to boot up and play from time to time.
I think Sonic 2 and Sonic CD are also pretty good, not on the same level of quality as S3&k but fun none the less. I also enjoy Sonic 1, but not as much as the others.
Sonic 3D blast though, not exactly Sega's greatest moment. pfffft
I think Sonic 2 and Sonic CD are also pretty good, not on the same level of quality as S3&k but fun none the less. I also enjoy Sonic 1, but not as much as the others.
Sonic 3D blast though, not exactly Sega's greatest moment. pfffft
Sonic CD is so easy. I adore the time travel gimmick, but the method of travel is extremely poorly planned out, and the zone difficulty itself doesn't seem to be well designed for it. The graphics and special stages might be my favorite though.
Sonic 2 does have a few difficulty spikes, particularly CPZ2 and the final boss, but it appears to me your main complaint is the fact that it doesn't have a save system. Sonic 2 for me is thrilling because it's designed around the lack of a save game, and beating the final boss for the first time is possibly the most satisfying moment I've had in a Sonic game. Not having to account for live stock spoils too many games for me, and I'm glad Sonic 2 doesn't suffer from that. I'd argue the levels are all great, brushing aside enemy placement and one badly planned spike pit, and the only zone I honestly would have done without was Oil Ocean Zone.
Sonic 2 does have a few difficulty spikes, particularly CPZ2 and the final boss, but it appears to me your main complaint is the fact that it doesn't have a save system. Sonic 2 for me is thrilling because it's designed around the lack of a save game, and beating the final boss for the first time is possibly the most satisfying moment I've had in a Sonic game. Not having to account for live stock spoils too many games for me, and I'm glad Sonic 2 doesn't suffer from that. I'd argue the levels are all great, brushing aside enemy placement and one badly planned spike pit, and the only zone I honestly would have done without was Oil Ocean Zone.
Ultimate
a scar in time...
I prefer Sonic 1 above all the rest. I'll say right off the bat that it was the first one I played, so I definitely have some bias there.
Visuals - The color scheme in all the stages is quite amazing and all the visual elements in the stages work together so well. Green Hill Zone is in my opinion, the most eye opening and stunning opening stage of any Sonic game. There is a strong contrast between the bright green, two-tone brown, and multiple shades of blue, yet they all work together very beautifully, without seeming at all messy (Sonic CD?). Angel Island, on the other hand is much less aesthetically pleasing. Marble Garden's purple, green, and reds make for beautiful contrast as well. Spring Yard - purple, brown, green, etc. The color scheme and level structure is wonderfully lively, vibrant, yet controlled in the best of ways.
Music - Sonic 1 tunes are extremely catchy and are great to listen to. From Green Hill all the way to Final Zone, there is not a single track that I didn't enjoy and there's a lot interesting musical stuff going on in them. Sonic 2 has an amazing soundtrack as well, Oil Ocean being the only piece I don't care much for. Sonic 3 was alright overall, but stages like Angel Island, Marble Garden, and Carnival Night, are not songs I particularly enjoy listening to. Although they fit the level very well, they are not songs that I find interesting or memorable. Ice Cap and Hydrocity are great highlights, however. Sonic & Knuckles has some great tunes as well. Flying Battery and Lava Reef are perhaps my favorites. Of course, all the boss themes are great throughout the Genesis Era.
Level Design - Sonic 1 had a great mix between platforming and speed. Sonic CD had a great amount of platforming, but the level design was often very cluttered and lacked the flow that Sonic 1 succeeded so well at. Sonic 2 pushed the speed aspect even further, which was mostly a good thing, but I feel like the stages were a bit too easy. Sonic 3 & Knuckles stages were quite fun, but I sometimes felt like the stages were too large without as much interest in each individual area. Although Sonic 1 stages were extremely short compared to S3&K standards, there was a lot packed into each area, and there was still a lot to explore.
Regarding bosses, the only boss that I really dislike in Sonic 1 is the Final Zone Boss. Way too easy...the other Genesis games really top Sonic 1 in this aspect. Sonic 1 definitely loses here, but I still enjoy most of its bosses.
Visuals - The color scheme in all the stages is quite amazing and all the visual elements in the stages work together so well. Green Hill Zone is in my opinion, the most eye opening and stunning opening stage of any Sonic game. There is a strong contrast between the bright green, two-tone brown, and multiple shades of blue, yet they all work together very beautifully, without seeming at all messy (Sonic CD?). Angel Island, on the other hand is much less aesthetically pleasing. Marble Garden's purple, green, and reds make for beautiful contrast as well. Spring Yard - purple, brown, green, etc. The color scheme and level structure is wonderfully lively, vibrant, yet controlled in the best of ways.
Music - Sonic 1 tunes are extremely catchy and are great to listen to. From Green Hill all the way to Final Zone, there is not a single track that I didn't enjoy and there's a lot interesting musical stuff going on in them. Sonic 2 has an amazing soundtrack as well, Oil Ocean being the only piece I don't care much for. Sonic 3 was alright overall, but stages like Angel Island, Marble Garden, and Carnival Night, are not songs I particularly enjoy listening to. Although they fit the level very well, they are not songs that I find interesting or memorable. Ice Cap and Hydrocity are great highlights, however. Sonic & Knuckles has some great tunes as well. Flying Battery and Lava Reef are perhaps my favorites. Of course, all the boss themes are great throughout the Genesis Era.
Level Design - Sonic 1 had a great mix between platforming and speed. Sonic CD had a great amount of platforming, but the level design was often very cluttered and lacked the flow that Sonic 1 succeeded so well at. Sonic 2 pushed the speed aspect even further, which was mostly a good thing, but I feel like the stages were a bit too easy. Sonic 3 & Knuckles stages were quite fun, but I sometimes felt like the stages were too large without as much interest in each individual area. Although Sonic 1 stages were extremely short compared to S3&K standards, there was a lot packed into each area, and there was still a lot to explore.
Regarding bosses, the only boss that I really dislike in Sonic 1 is the Final Zone Boss. Way too easy...the other Genesis games really top Sonic 1 in this aspect. Sonic 1 definitely loses here, but I still enjoy most of its bosses.
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Wombatwarlord777
"...What?"
Speaking of final bosses... The one thing I truly despise about Sonic 2 is its final boss. It's a really boring fight that's highly choreographed and is a challenge only because it's all too easy to land a hit on Robotnik as he crashes down, only to glitch into his embracing deadly arms.
I'm also kind of surprised to hear that a few people don't really care for Oil Ocean. Personally, it's my favorite stage in the game. The only thing I don't like is the placements of those seahorse badniks.
I'm also kind of surprised to hear that a few people don't really care for Oil Ocean. Personally, it's my favorite stage in the game. The only thing I don't like is the placements of those seahorse badniks.
Goldenhog
Wandering Protagonist
No love for Sonic Crackers? But Crackers is the best one!
Jellybones
Lawful Neutral
You're kidding, right? Eraser is some puzzle game with Sonic slapped onto it. It can't feel "more like Sonic" than the Genesis trilogy.
I used to like 3D Blast, but I was a kid and didn't seem aware of the slippery controls. Although, those special stages in the Saturn version were cool. Though they're something of a tease considering the absence of a proper Sonic on that system. That being said, I actually like the Genesis special stages better since they're easier, heh.
Anyway, I generally like the whole series except Sonic 1- the level design is absolutely annoying past Green Hill. Marble Zone's sudden difficulty spike, then that next stage's stupid pinball-things. Ugh.
pretty sure that was satire
Daywalker
The Daily Browser
As far as feeling like an overall adventure I liked going through Sonic 3&K wins hands down, but as far as "level balance" for lack of a better word or phrase, Sonic 2.
In the Sonic 3 half it just feels like the levels after Marble Garden Zone are much weaker, it felt to me as if they put a lot of effort to make Marble Garden as expansive as possible where the later zones feel more straightforward than it. Same with Sandopolis Zone in the S&K half to an extent; although with that zone it just seems like it deals moreover to Act 2 dragging on forever if you do not know how to blaze through it instead of the zone overall being more expansive like Marble Garden Zone.
Personally, the zones seemed to be more balanced out even with the difficulty spikes in Sonic 2 since exploration did not get as huge as an emphasis as a lot of the zones in Sonic 3&K overall. Just seems to me like Sonic 2 was easier for the team to manage as far as keeping stuff balanced out and flowing fairly well for the most part.
Sonic CD, despite being a Sega CD game, deserves an honorable mention from me for how it handled exploration from me for the most of the levels since it still was a Sonic game that could be considered part of the Genesis era. I enjoyed the game a lot and felt that it was onto something with how it handled exploration, just needed quite a bit more polish.
In the Sonic 3 half it just feels like the levels after Marble Garden Zone are much weaker, it felt to me as if they put a lot of effort to make Marble Garden as expansive as possible where the later zones feel more straightforward than it. Same with Sandopolis Zone in the S&K half to an extent; although with that zone it just seems like it deals moreover to Act 2 dragging on forever if you do not know how to blaze through it instead of the zone overall being more expansive like Marble Garden Zone.
Personally, the zones seemed to be more balanced out even with the difficulty spikes in Sonic 2 since exploration did not get as huge as an emphasis as a lot of the zones in Sonic 3&K overall. Just seems to me like Sonic 2 was easier for the team to manage as far as keeping stuff balanced out and flowing fairly well for the most part.
Sonic CD, despite being a Sega CD game, deserves an honorable mention from me for how it handled exploration from me for the most of the levels since it still was a Sonic game that could be considered part of the Genesis era. I enjoyed the game a lot and felt that it was onto something with how it handled exploration, just needed quite a bit more polish.
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I hate Marble Garden Zone because it forces that clunky spinning thing for a good chunk of the zone. Carnival Night Zone is also awkward because of the spinning barrel, but it's not as obvious until halfway into Act 2. I actually like the rest onward, even though the most of the S&K portion becomes decidedly "normal" up until Hidden Palace Zone.
fevermario
Member
sonic labyrinth is and always will be the best sonic game ever. *shot*
jokeing aside...my favorite classic game is sonic 3 and knuckles. good music, fun gameplay,
knuckles, hyper sonic. what's not to love?
jokeing aside...my favorite classic game is sonic 3 and knuckles. good music, fun gameplay,
knuckles, hyper sonic. what's not to love?
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