Stages / Levels thread

[Pyrakid Wolfo]

Started this thread so I could complain about how many shield monitors Techno Hill Zone Act 2 has, and hear other people say their thoughts and what changes they would like to some levels.
Anyone volunteer to count every shield monitor in Techno Hill Act 2? Goop could be slightly easier to sink through, Knuckles just gets goop loot for free because he can climb under it (Which doesn't even make sense) and jump glide.
There are plenty of better places to put emblems. I mean there was this one spot that I didn't even know existed and it has a life monitor and i have 50 lives.
Deep Sea Act 2... there's also some good spots for emblems or tokens that might have a ring monitor instead.

 

[clairebun]

Goop would be a lot cooler if it was straight-up reverse gravity water. Like, imagine taking a deep dive and then exploring submerged terrain by platforming on the ceilings of the terrain. The concept is incredibly underutilized.

 

[Pyrakid Wolfo]

Goop would be a lot cooler if it was straight-up reverse gravity water. Like, imagine taking a deep dive and then exploring submerged terrain by platforming on the ceilings of the terrain. The concept is incredibly underutilized.

That would be a neat gimmick but what sense does it make for it to work like that? Not saying they couldn't do that of course.

 

[lnferno]

The only change that would need to be done to make it work as Cobalt suggested is just making it so that if a character touches a ceiling whilst in goop, they land on their feet, and can move around normally (or as normally as you can in goop), but with the upwards push still applying if you jump, as far as I'm convinced. This would make goop effectively reverse high-gravity water. As for logic, I mean, it's basically just the character getting grip of whatever they are stuck to.

 

[clairebun]

That would be a neat gimmick but what sense does it make for it to work like that? Not saying they couldn't do that of course.

If you really think about it, it's already more or less reverse gravity water. What I'm basically suggesting is that the character doesn't hit their head once they touch a ceiling, but instead they're able to walk on it.

 

[TrustyGun]

If you really think about it, it's already more or less reverse gravity water. What I'm basically suggesting is that the character doesn't hit their head once they touch a ceiling, but instead they're able to walk on it.

That sounds awesome. I can already imagine the possible challenges where you need to repeatedly jump in and out of the goo, going higher on each side in order to get enough height to reach the exit.

 

[cookiefonster]

Techno Hill Act 2 has very weird monitor placement, with many monitors put in areas that make them easy to lose rather than helping teach what they're useful for. I think it would make a lot more sense to an attraction shield or two by electrical hazards, to make it clear that's what they protect from, and perhaps not lay it so thick with the speed shoes either. The speed shoes at the start should stay because they let Amy and Fang skip the piston section up the slope, but the rest I'm not sure about. I'm really not sure why there are so many armageddon shields there either, since it tends to be more detrimental than helpful in the zone with the usefulness of spring shells.

Also, as you requested, here's a list of monitor count in Techno Hill Act 2:

• Super Ring: 41
• Attraction Shield: 4
• Force Shield: 3
• Armageddon Shield: 4
• Whirlwind Shield: 4
• Elemental Shield: 6
• Speed shoes: 6
• Invincibility: 2
• Extra life: 12
• Eggman: 1 (in an inaccessible area)
• Gold Eggman: 1 (in an inaccessible area)

I'd like to point out that a monitor count distribution like this is par for the course in current SRB2 levels, but THZ2 has monitors considerably easier to find than in other zones. They're just not quite as cleverly hidden there, and in many cases, they're very hard to keep or make good use of. It would also most certainly be nice if items under goop were made just a little easier to collect.

 

[Unknownlight]

Goop would be a lot cooler if it was straight-up reverse gravity water. Like, imagine taking a deep dive and then exploring submerged terrain by platforming on the ceilings of the terrain. The concept is incredibly underutilized.

I adore this. The moment I read your post I instantly realized that this is what goop was always meant to be.

 

[cookiefonster]

If you really think about it, it's already more or less reverse gravity water. What I'm basically suggesting is that the character doesn't hit their head once they touch a ceiling, but instead they're able to walk on it.

That sounds like an incredibly cool idea, and I never thought of goop as reverse gravity water before. In SRB2's current state, it feels very awkward to fumble around in goop when you hit the top of a ceiling. Allowing reverse gravity platforming under goop would substantially increase the currently rather low amount of things you can do in goop.

 

[azoo]

Lava eating all your rings in Red Volcano makes navigating that level way more frustrating than it needs to be. Considering how many areas in that stage are massive pits of just lava, getting dropped in the middle of one leaves you better off just accepting death rather than trying to rush through the i-frames to safety. ESPECIALLY when you're Sonic, where you have no means to glide onto a wall or fly out of harm's way.

What if lava left Sonic quickly losing rings in chunks, with a trail of rings left behind him as he bounces off the lava like Mario does in his 3D games (until he's out of rings, then there's i-frames before death)? They'll still melt upon contact with no way to retrieve them, but the bounces and incremental ring-loss will make for a more forgiving recovery.

Goop would be a lot cooler if it was straight-up reverse gravity water. Like, imagine taking a deep dive and then exploring submerged terrain by platforming on the ceilings of the terrain. The concept is incredibly underutilized.

Also I love this idea. Would be super on board for it.

 

[Pyrakid Wolfo]

Anyone want to guess how many rings are in Techno Hill Zone Act 1? I already know the answer, just wanted to see if anyone could guess.

 

[SilverVortex]

Lava eating all your rings in Red Volcano makes navigating that level way more frustrating than it needs to be. Considering how many areas in that stage are massive pits of just lava, getting dropped in the middle of one leaves you better off just accepting death rather than trying to rush through the i-frames to safety. ESPECIALLY when you're Sonic, where you have no means to glide onto a wall or fly out of harm's way.

on the contrary, i think this is an extremely good mechanic. rather than having massive bottomless pits, you get a second chance to redeem yourself with some invincibility frames instead of instant death. in fact, this makes red volcano one of the most forgiving stages in the entire game.

 

[cookiefonster]

on the contrary, i think this is an extremely good mechanic. rather than having massive bottomless pits, you get a second chance to redeem yourself with some invincibility frames instead of instant death. in fact, this makes red volcano one of the most forgiving stages in the entire game.

I wouldn't say it's forgiving, necessarily. Maybe it's forgiving compared to zones that heavily use death pits, but the primary hazard in the level (lava) does destroy rings, unlike let's say Arid Canyon where most hazards aside from death pits make you lose your rings as usual. I view lava as an intermediate between damaging floors and full-out death pits.

 

[Pyrakid Wolfo]

on the contrary, i think this is an extremely good mechanic. rather than having massive bottomless pits, you get a second chance to redeem yourself with some invincibility frames instead of instant death. in fact, this makes red volcano one of the most forgiving stages in the entire game.

...what? I mean maybe more forgiving than Egg Rock and Arid Canyon, but Red Volcano is a quite tight stage, it's level design isn't very forgiving even if the fact it doesn't have pits is. Having a lack of death pits doesn't make a level forgiving. Do NOT call Red Volcano one of the most forgiving, it doesn't sound right.

And yes, I know Castle Eggman exists.

 

[SilverVortex]

Do NOT call Red Volcano one of the most forgiving, it doesn't sound right.

i said forgiving, not easy lol.

and anyway, i do indeed think it is extremely forgiving of mistakes and messing up despite the ring destroying lava, since you're still in control of whatever character you're using and you do have enough time to make a jump or spindash before the invincibility wears off.
i think the challenge in red volcano comes from the enemies and hazards rather than the lava, since the lava strips you of your rings and the enemies, fire and lava falls finish you off.

And yes, I know Castle Eggman exists.

i also think castle eggman is pretty forgiving if not moreso, but it's super tedious as a cost of that.

arid canyon, egg rock, aerial garden, haunted heights and azure temple are all less or extremely less forgiving than red volcano, especially the latter three.

 

[clairebun]

I think lava killing rings is a useful mechanic, but lava itself is probably a little too common for the first act and doesn't always have accessible enough escape routes.

 

[time gear]

If I were to make one change to the way lava works, it would be for it to take your rings in chunks. Still destroy them on contact, but not cause all of them you are holding to drop all at once. Perhaps have like 10 rings drop once every second? This would probably require reduced invincibility frames specifically for touching lava though. It would also work as a potential to have Metal Sonic suffer the same thing, but not take knockback damage from touching lava since he doesn't feel pain. Basically, he'd drop 10 rings a second but not get knocked back from it. Any rings that land on solid ground, he could go grab before they despawn. Perhaps as a tradeoff, his hover could be disabled for a few seconds after touching lava so that he can't just cheese it to escape, but it can still be used as long as the player is careful not to touch the lava.

This would make escaping lava more of a struggle for the fleshy characters, but still give a forgiving window of opportunity to escape without losing all your rings and getting finished off by other things in the level.

 

[Spiky]

I'm not big on rings disappearing on lava. Not only does it make things needlessly frustrating, but I always thought it looked more like a bug than a feature =V

 

[Shaddy the guy]

I'm not big on rings disappearing on lava. Not only does it make things needlessly frustrating, but I always thought it looked more like a bug than a feature =V

That's actually a good point, I think a lot of people might struggle because they don't immediately connect why their rings aren't coming back. A little particle effect for lava eating the rings would be helpful to that end.