Slope Questions

Sinny33

Sinny the Fennec is my YT
I not going to complain about me and the Discord Server (and not knowing how to censor sentences and for spam spoilering because a video came out when 2.2 did that showed the characters which made me do this in the first place.)

It's mainly about Slopes in general like these Questions

1) How were slopes created and put into SRB2?

2) How did Slopes influenced some levels in the game?

3)Would Slopes also influenced Loops if there are plans for those?

4)How long did you guys plan on adding slopes into the game in the first place?

5) What are your overall opinions on Slopes?
 
Ooh ooh I can answer these!


1) I made them https://mb.srb2.org/showpost.php?p=767788&postcount=168 (the internal data struct and some code used for collision is based on CB, the plane rendering is adapted from ZDoom, and the wall rendering and all physics are original)


2) The whole game was remade around them lmao


3) Loops are not feasible with the current sprite set and would not be worth the extra effort to add


4) The dev team spent 17 years telling everyone they were impossible in SRB2's engine and I had a full implementation ready in about a month


5) I wish I had focused on fixing the minor physics bugs (like getting stuck at the tops of minor inclines) instead of fighting against acceleration on steep slopes when Sonic can just thok up anyway, but I'd rather have them with their slightly quirky physics than not have them at all
 
5) I wish I had focused on fixing the minor physics bugs (like getting stuck at the tops of minor inclines) instead of fighting against acceleration on steep slopes when Sonic can just thok up anyway, but I'd rather have them with their slightly quirky physics than not have them at all

Oh, it's good to know this is considered to be a bug and not intentional behavior. Does that mean it's planned to be fixed at some point in the future?
 
Ooh ooh I can answer these!


1) I made them https://mb.srb2.org/showpost.php?p=767788&postcount=168 (the internal data struct and some code used for collision is based on CB, the plane rendering is adapted from ZDoom, and the wall rendering and all physics are original)


Haha oh wow, reading through that thread brought me to this post in 2015:


...uh, no, let's not go around in circles please.

How about I just answer why we're not going to do several things:

  • Port SRB2 to engine x, e.g ZDoom, Source:
    No way, SRB2 on the current engine (Doom Legacy) is about 16 years old as it is, we're not going back on all those years of work only to make SRB2 that little more "modern". It's no simple matter of porting anyhow; we've modified the Doom Legacy engine too much for our own purposes, might as well call it the "SRB2 engine" at this point.
  • Port SRB2CB's slopes into SRB2:
    They're not actually that brilliant nor is the physics for them complete, and support for everything from PolyObjects to Software mode is absent. Even Kalaron himself probably realised it was not worth it; the many OpenGL fixes as well as skyboxes were worth it much more (and most of which have since been added to SRB2 2.1 itself!). Lack of Software mode support (SRB2CB is designed exclusively around OpenGL if that wasn't obvious already) means we wouldn't have renderer parity in our SRB2 until a Software version of slopes existed - i.e. no renderer parity, no SRB2CB slopes. Not much more to be said.

    On an aside, an old test map of mine involving SRB2CB's slopes eats up memory so badly last I remember. Now the question is whether this issue is related to the slopes or something else... I have no idea currently.
  • Port ZDoom's slopes into SRB2:
    SSNTails once tried to do this himself back in the days of the old SRB2 forums (something like 2000-2002 IIRC)... from what I remember seeing of his posts, via Wayback Machine, he had issues with doing so because of ZDoom referencing stuff from another game he didn't want to touch. I forget if he said whether it was licensing issues or not, would be best if SSN cleared this question up himself? If it is like so, this probably means we can't add them from ZDoom itself.
  • Add slopes into SRB2 at all, either by porting or by doing-it-ourselves:
    We don't actually need them for SRB2 to survive! Our levels have survived for up to a decade and a half without slopes as it is; if we finally put in slopes, people would deride all of SRB2's levels including ERZ for being out-of-date and not having slopes and we'd be nagged to put slopes everywhere. Essentially it'd require a remake of all levels in SRB2 for everyone to be happy, which won't be fun. (Perhaps I'm exaggurating the consequences here... perhaps.)

    Adding slopes to SRB2 would probably also lead to a very slippery slope (no pun intended) of physics-related feature creep, or at least potential for one - next people will be expecting SRB2 to have things like loops and sideways gravity, which themselves have a boat-load of issues which I will not go over here.


Well THAT post sure aged poorly XP
 
Haha oh wow, reading through that thread brought me to this post in 2015:

Well THAT post sure aged poorly XP

It didn't age poorly at all! Things happened exactly as predicted! The introduction of slopes caused nearly every level in the game to be thrown out and remade from scratch, and Egg Rock Zone—the one zone that hasn't been remade yet—feels outdated.
 
My point is that a dev straight up stated they were never going to do...what they just did with 2.2. Not just "we would like to but it'd be a big scope increase" but "It's never happening and we don't need it anyway".
 
Now we just need the devs to port the game to GZDoom, then we can place all the eggs on MI's face :P
 

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