My FULL 2.1 Review

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speed2411

Speed2411
I have been waiting for 2.1.7 to come out so I can write this. At last, here we go. As it turns out, 2.1 brings a lot of new features. Some are really fun, and others are a step in the wrong direction. Now a few people have already brought up these features and pointed to what may or may not be okay for this type of fan game. Before I begin, let me just say this is MY opinion. I just wanted to get my opinion out and see if others agree or disagree. So in other words, this entire thing I'm writing MIGHT be wrong. I don't expect me to be right at all. I just want to see if people agree with me on anything I say. I also took the liberty, so this is not a super long thing, to divide my points of interest by chapters so you can breeze through my review with no problem... Let's begin shall we.

Single Player
You guys made the single player VERY fun. I have to say. I enjoyed collected the emblems. At first I was not sure about the special stages, but nights mode actually suits Srb2. It's really fun to collect the blue spheres to win. I also REALLY enjoy the Metal sonic race. Very fun indeed. I love Pipe Towers and Azure temple, along with Ariel Garden. This right here was a perfectly good thing for Srb2. NOTHING about single player is bad at all. If anything, Eggrock zone could be just a BIT harder, but I guess that's why there are unlockables. A suggestion though, for Srb1. I would include a method of saving your progress for Srb1 in case you don't want to beat the entire thing all at once. Other then that, I feel like this was a perfectly good addition to 2.1

Netplay
As a complete contrast to single player, netplay has become completely unbearable.I can no longer host a server, or join a server because of the sync fails. Now I know you guys already know the netcode is really bad, so no need to address that since you guys are obviously trying to fix it. Although, I do suggest one thing. Perhaps a feature to disable Sync Fails... I don't know how hard that would be... I can't code so yeah. I don't expect you to do anything I say. Other then that... I guess it's okay.

Match/Ctf rotation
Now I see you guys added the levels you thought were the best. I don't know about you guys, but I felt you should have added MOST of the levels that were in the Beta's that were released. I really liked Converyer Conflict Zone.

Weapons
Alright, here we go. The weapons itself are not bad. I really like the new grenade system. HOWEVER, the way you guys made the bombs is not really a good idea.

1. It not only defaults people to other weapons to spam, but it also decreases it's over all use.

2. Super is now more op then ever. Before, super was easily taken on by grenades, scatters, and bombs. But now that scatters ammo has been dropped, the only thing the could stand up to super is grenades, and that's not that effective and does not give players much of a choice. Bombs should be remade like back in 2.0.

The infinite ring was a nice touch, and gives us a nostalgic effect. However, if it's not TOO hard, the ability to switch from 2.0 weapons and 109.4 weapons. This is just a mere idea, an undevolped thought. I really think something like that is WAY too much to ask considering you guys are still making this game on your own free time, and I respect that.

Race levels
Let's look at the race levels. OH WAIT! There are none... By removing race, you default back to the logic "because people to this too much, let's take it away." That's like saying, "Too many people use blue as a color, lets remove it." Now I obviously have more to say. I understand that the reason it was removed was because the maps were not balanced between the three players, but to they HAVE to be? You guys are taking this fan game a BIT too serious... And that's what people are afraid of.

Stafteing.
Strafting has become WAY easier to use. 2.0 strafte just felt too stiff. However, I would like to point out that strafte on has been taken away, and that was pretty much my life here. Now I know you guys said it was buggy, (I did not feel any bugs but whatever...) but can you guys TRY to fix strafte on... For me please? This is pretty much souly my opinion here.

Overall rating
Overall, I doubt this update took four years in the making. There were WAY more features in the transition from 109.4 to 2.0. Now, it's not like I'm saying I could do it any faster then you. I'm saying, if you guys really wanted to finish Srb2, I really think it would have taken less time then four years. Now the reason I wrote this was not to yell about things that are wrong with the game, but more of a suggestive thing of main points you guys should really focus on. For starters, little gimmicks that are gone.

1. Beedee was removed from the game.

2. Orderpizza command was removed.

3. Easter egg hunt was remvoed.

4. Christmas mode was removed.

5. Cheats mode has been made stricter to prevent abuse in netgames.

6. Players can no longer switch characters in match/ctf.

What all these have in common is that they were put in place to prevent the abusive things we all knew and love. The point of Srb2 is NOT to make a fangame that is stiff and unfun, but to have fun MAKING the game itself...SNNTails had fun making the game, and that's why he included all the little gimmicks and stuff... But the more updates that keep happening, the more serious the game gets.

So to end this little thing, I want to remind the people who actually read this, thank you for your time. Now this is my opinion and my opinion alone, and I would love to see if you guys agree or not. I could be looked at as "stupid" in Mystic eyes, and a "untamed visionary" in Shadow Hog's eyes. (That will never happen :P) Once again, thank you, and hopefully my thoughts will get put under consideration.
 

Mystic

Member
Let's look at the race levels. OH WAIT! There are none...
Race is now intended to be played on the single player stages, which are more interesting than the circuit levels were anyways.

1. Beedee was removed from the game.

2. Orderpizza command was removed.
These are old jokes that most people won't get. I'd wager the number of people who remember what the orderpizza command was even joking about is less than ten. The Beedee reference is so incredibly old that nobody still on the team was even around when it was made.

3. Easter egg hunt was remvoed.
Honestly, it wasn't. The new emblem system is essentially the easter egg hunt, just without the requirement that you have to change your system clock to activate it.

4. Christmas mode was removed.
Thank god it finally died in 2.0. That mode was the source of so much grief. Go play glaber's awful mod that reimplements it if you really desire to play such a thing.

5. Cheats mode has been made stricter to prevent abuse in netgames.

6. Players can no longer switch characters in match/ctf.

What all these have in common is that they were put in place to prevent the abusive things we all knew and love.
You basically explained the reason right there. We're trying to prevent abusive things. While breaking the game can be fun for a small period, the novelty wears off fast. This is the entire purpose of having a cheats flag to begin with: to allow you to goof off and do silly things, but clearly label it as not normal gameplay.

But the more updates that keep happening, the more serious the game gets.
You say that, yet the new version boots up with a scene of Eggman eating an entire truck of lard.

I think what you're really objecting to is an intent to put more focus in the game's unity. Past SRB2 versions have had a lot of silly, out of place elements that really didn't fit with the game as a whole. While those silly things are often fondly remembered, the game as a whole is a better package if everything is clean and consistent. I think the integration of the easter egg hunt as the new hidden emblem structure best embodies my point. We took a good, fun feature that was implemented weirdly and implemented it properly in a way that doesn't feel out of place.
 
I really like 2.1. Mostly because the new emblem system which is really fun and challenging (and also, dat water and slime are AMAZING!). All these changes seem to take the fun, but they actually make this game better and I know there is a reason they were removed. But the only thing that annoyis me is the removal of the race maps. Ok the single player stages are better. But what if, somewhere, a new player enters options, then server options and gametype options and sees " lap number " at race? It's confusing because you can't lap on the single player levels.

About the cheats, I can't even figure out how to turn them on. I typed "cheats on" but it didn't work, but I see that setlives and setrings work only in single player now.

And what was so bad at christmas mode? There are the same levels with a different music and different textures.
 

EternallyAries

That Aries Title
To be quite honest, this review is not that great. But that my opinion.

Netplay

As a complete contrast to single player, netplay has become completely unbearable.I can no longer host a server, or join a server because of the sync fails. Now I know you guys already know the netcode is really bad, so no need to address that since you guys are obviously trying to fix it. Although, I do suggest one thing. Perhaps a feature to disable Sync Fails... I don't know how hard that would be... I can't code so yeah. I don't expect you to do anything I say. Other then that... I guess it's okay.

Sync is pretty much consistency failure but with a name replacement and a warning on top of it I believe. Correct me if I am wrong though.

Match/Ctf rotation

Now I see you guys added the levels you thought were the best. I don't know about you guys, but I felt you should have added MOST of the levels that were in the Beta's that were released. I really liked Converyer Conflict Zone.

I don't really see the need for that level, and most of the betas we're just eh compared to the ones we have now.

Weapons

Alright, here we go. The weapons itself are not bad. I really like the new grenade system. HOWEVER, the way you guys made the bombs is not really a good idea.

1. It not only defaults people to other weapons to spam, but it also decreases it's over all use.

2. Super is now more op then ever. Before, super was easily taken on by grenades, scatters, and bombs. But now that scatters ammo has been dropped, the only thing the could stand up to super is grenades, and that's not that effective and does not give players much of a choice. Bombs should be remade like back in 2.0.

The infinite ring was a nice touch, and gives us a nostalgic effect. However, if it's not TOO hard, the ability to switch from 2.0 weapons and 109.4 weapons. This is just a mere idea, an undevolped thought. I really think something like that is WAY too much to ask considering you guys are still making this game on your own free time, and I respect that.

You honestly don't see how unfair 1.09.4 weapons we're compare to the current 2.1 weapon set is as of now? If they added the option to add it back in. The weapons would be automatic bomb rails combined most of the time. It would be beyond unfair if this was added back in. If you want it back so badly, use 1.09.4 then. I am quite happy with 2.1 weapons. As for super being over powered. You should keep in mind. Its the same as ever. You gotta rethink on new ideas on how to defeat them. the grenades may not be thrown up in the air as it used to be. So spread it all over the ground. I bet you a super player will run into one 95% of the time. Scatters ammo limit was also lowered because it is quite powerful of a weapon, and having a large amount is just asking for a spamfest of scatters all over the place, just like 2.0 was. I highly am happy with the lower limit.

Race levels

Let's look at the race levels. OH WAIT! There are none... By removing race, you default back to the logic "because people to this too much, let's take it away." That's like saying, "Too many people use blue as a color, lets remove it." Now I obviously have more to say. I understand that the reason it was removed was because the maps were not balanced between the three players, but to they HAVE to be? You guys are taking this fan game a BIT too serious... And that's what people are afraid of.

And as for race, I do miss the circuit levels as much as the next guy. But it was completely unbalance for players that use Tails and Knuckles. And the levels we're quite bland to be quite honest. Also you can add the circuit levels right back into 2.1 if you like, by simply ripping it out of the SRB2.SRB file from 2.0, I think they would run just fine. But the level headers might need some changes.

Stafteing.

Strafting has become WAY easier to use. 2.0 strafte just felt too stiff. However, I would like to point out that strafte on has been taken away, and that was pretty much my life here. Now I know you guys said it was buggy, (I did not feel any bugs but whatever...) but can you guys TRY to fix strafte on... For me please? This is pretty much souly my opinion here.

Honestly, I see no need for this to be added again. I can a sure you very, very few players even use such option. Its pretty much asking for Auto Aim added back into 2.1, Its as useless as that.

Overall rating

1. Beedee was removed from the game.

2. Orderpizza command was removed.

3. Easter egg hunt was remvoed.

4. Christmas mode was removed.

5. Cheats mode has been made stricter to prevent abuse in netgames.

6. Players can no longer switch characters in match/ctf.

What all these have in common is that they were put in place to prevent the abusive things we all knew and love. The point of Srb2 is NOT to make a fangame that is stiff and unfun, but to have fun MAKING the game itself...SNNTails had fun making the game, and that's why he included all the little gimmicks and stuff... But the more updates that keep happening, the more serious the game gets.

That a overall rating? Anyway, Easter Egg hunt was removed I believe in 1.09.4? I don't see any reason for you to even bring that up. Orderpizza and beedee was removed because it was beyond annoying and useless. Christmas mode was removed because it was just stupid, and broken as fuck. Cheats are more strict because, hey I want to know what server I am about to join and know what him/her has change for a server with cheat is showing beforehand. I like that fix up. And the player switch can be turned on and off. Just look though the menus, and you should find it with ease. And serious? Really? The damn intro is good enough to show you how "Serious" this game is.
 
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speed2411

Speed2411
Okay... I agree with that intro thing, but the main point I'n trying to say it, why remove the old joks? Just because a little thing is old does not mean you should remove them... Still, I can see where you guys are coming from with this. If you all think it's better like this, it most likely is.

Edit: although cheats should be brought back the way it was...
 
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TelosTurntable

How the turns have tel- tab-
I still want the race rotation back.
Maybe I should just port them from 2.0, although it'll be all screwed up.
I'll try.
 
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That2rb2DUDE

Pro Splatoon 2 Player
I could do with out the circuit race tracks mainly because I never played them and it was always unfair due to the sonic being overpowered and C-lag combination.


One thing I would want to see back is Mlooksens. I want to reduce the speed when looking up and down but still be able to look left and right fast.
 

Burning-Fox

Does not approve of rails.
I already ported the "CIRCUIT" maps from 2.0. I'm sure that people won't mind, what with it being separate from the actual vanilla game. 4Shared is your friend.

Cheats were insanely overused on every server ever. It got really annoying, really fast. Virtually every server you joined had the host setting 9999 rings and everyone went super and made the game absolutely no challenge. Like, seriously. ¬¬ It ticked me right off.

"Lolololol we beat the game loooooooool." - You wouldn't have done if you didn't have 99 lives over and over again and all emeralds + 9999 rings everytime you died.

-Edit-

Super IS OP. It always HAS been. But it's even more so in 2.1. Not because of the crap you said. (It's not hard to walk up to someone and spray them in the face with autos, and if you can't collect ammo, your own issue.)
It's because Super Sonic is basically... FAST. Like he SHOULD be. Like, holy shit. You see someone, they are DEAD. No questions. Though in my opinion it should stay this way. You LET them get the emeralds. You EARNED them yourself, in some cases too. You deserve a good reward. :I

(Also you can outright ignore the super player and just score points off other players faster than they do, normally that works)
 
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Mystic

Member
Okay... I agree with that intro thing, but the main point I'n trying to say it, why remove the old joks? Just because a little thing is old does not mean you should remove them... Still, I can see where you guys are coming from with this. If you all think it's better like this, it most likely is.
That's not what I said. I said the jokes were removed because nobody got them anymore, not directly because they're old. The new intro is actually just a conversion of a really old movie file that dates back about 10 years. The difference here is that Eggman eating a truck of lard is funny without needing to understand some stupid reference from a decade ago.

The problem basically stems from the difference between an inside joke and a normal joke. Inside jokes require inside knowledge to understand, and therefore most people aren't going to get them. With some of our older easter eggs, that inside knowledge is so rarefied that I'd wager the only person still around that gets them is AJ. I've been on the team for over a decade and I have no idea why B^D is supposed to be funny. Most of the old easter eggs in the game were like this, from RedXVI (How many of you know the original joke here) to random sound files of a Pikachu getting decapitated by a chainsaw. People who get inside jokes tend to like them because they feel like they're part of an exclusive club, but those are the kinds of things that should be confined to the community and not the game itself.
 

Jellybones

Lawful Neutral
I'd like to know as well. I never even heard of Bee Dee, or knew the order pizza joke (I really just thought it was ordering pizza, not an in-joke)

Another good example of an out of place joke is probably Zim and his match level.

I mean we all know who Zim is and generally enjoy the show, but it certainly felt out place. That being said the color choice is a wonderful nod to to a past era.
 

Mystic

Member
The original RedXVI reference was a simple plug for his fangame, Sonic MADventure. He'd then tell you to go away and if you didn't, he'd crash the game with a sarcastic message. Hence the running joke of him getting irritated with the player not leaving him alone and then sending you off to hell or something similar.

EDIT: Order pizza was a joke making fun of Everquest 2, which had a REAL command in-game to order a pizza, because clearly MMO players are such sad sacks of human beings that they can't reach over to the phone to order a pizza.

This basically is exactly why I'm trying to get these kinds of references removed from the game, because nobody gets it and newer players will just go "I don't get it". I don't object to being silly on occasion, but those jokes should be humorous without any prior experience with SRB2.
 
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VelocitOni

KartKrew Dev
Sonic Team Junior
Kart Krew™️
I think you should just implement relevant jokes for novelty, rather than only get rid of all the old ones that literally predate 99% of the userbase :V.





(beedee)
 
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