I open debate: Srb2 doesn't really feel like sonic
- Thread starter Chariman
- Start date
Nicolas618
Member
I...Dont remember doing that in the Classics lol
Sonic Robo Blast 2.3 will have momentum, just like the Classics
And... Loopings in 3D Doesn't work that good at all unless its automated, i mean in 3D you can just skip it, if you couldn't, the level should be less open, and i dont think that will happen
Chariman
Member
Wait
well, in that case it could be put in places that are not necessarily linear.
What I mean is that they will not be placed in optional places
(for example: the bridge after the first checkpoint of greenflower zone act 1,
Post automatically merged:
well, in that case it could be put in places that are not necessarily linear.
What I mean is that they will not be placed in optional places
(for example: the bridge after the first checkpoint of greenflower zone act 1,
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lnferno
Not Here Anymore
For your original 1st point: this is due to how the Doom engine works, sadly.
As for this: you could still skip it by jumping through the middle. This is part of why loops have either become fully automated (fully going against Classic Sonic level design philosophy, hence why this wouldn't happen in SRB2) or just have faded out of use in recent games.
However, yes, something like Momentum Mod and a general physics revamp IS occurring in 2.3, somewhat partly for the reasons you said here.
rocklight124
An Avenger
Trying to put loops in a 3D Sonic game without scripting is nearly impossible. Name 1 official Sonic game that does so...?
Chezi
Co-Lead Sonic Robo Smash Dev
The only 3D sonic game that allows for unscripted loops is Classic Sonic's sections in Generations and Forces (It technically is still a 3D game since Classic Sonic's levels is entirely covered in Modern Sonic's 2D sections)
Chariman
Member
mmmmhhhh.
that doesn't take away the desire to have a wall walk
Chezi
Co-Lead Sonic Robo Smash Dev
You do know that most of the reasons SRB2 lacks certain features is because of how Doom works, right? Doom has very poor wall detection simply because walls technically don’t exist
Chariman
Member
More than anything it would be visual moments, so I don't think it is a problem not to include lupings.
Chezi
Co-Lead Sonic Robo Smash Dev
I’m not sure if you understand the problem with how actual 3D loops have been presented. They’re almost always a scripted sequence. Sure, it looks cool, but there’s only so many ways that you can change up that sequence before it gets old. Once it does get old, what’s left? 5-10 seconds of gameplay taken away from the player. Aside from pure lack of resources needed in order to add loops to SRB2 at the moment, that is the reason loops aren’t present
Saturn Ross
The Local Bird-Brain
Hey, 8-Bit Sonic could get by without the loops! While the later 8-Bit games had loops, they felt a bit odd to go through due to the engine differences, kinda like the situation here with SRB2. But it still all felt like a distinctly Sonic experience. And both SRB2 and the 8-Bit games have a key thing to help keep the gameplay fast and fun- Slopes! and really good level design, but I digress. Slopes in both games can send you flying at high speeds and launch you off like the Genesis titles, but more importantly you stay in control the whole time- you pick how you wanna go down, decide where you're going to jump off too, and spin if you want that extra speed. SRB2 could tap into that chaotic pinball energy a bit more I admit like with how fun GFZ2's slopes are, especially the one that ramps off into the open waterfall area. I consider them to be superior to loops in a way, they have a really good spectacle to them just like loops and they let you keep in control as explained.
On the wall note... it might work wherever Knuckles' climb does? It's just really finicky and you'll fall off if the wall curves even slightly... Mighty's wall kicking from Chaotix would be cool too, and is even given to the cast in the new Tether mod- and it works like a dream! And as for momentum, IIRC it's being experimented with by the devs and there's also like, 4 momentum mods for the game now? I played 3, Cobalt's Momentum, Rumia's Classic Physics and lastly XMomentum by Frostii. They're all super fun and I reccomend them all, it comes down to personal preference- my fave would be Cobalt's version for it's compatibility.
On the wall note... it might work wherever Knuckles' climb does? It's just really finicky and you'll fall off if the wall curves even slightly... Mighty's wall kicking from Chaotix would be cool too, and is even given to the cast in the new Tether mod- and it works like a dream! And as for momentum, IIRC it's being experimented with by the devs and there's also like, 4 momentum mods for the game now? I played 3, Cobalt's Momentum, Rumia's Classic Physics and lastly XMomentum by Frostii. They're all super fun and I reccomend them all, it comes down to personal preference- my fave would be Cobalt's version for it's compatibility.
Shaddy the guy
Professional ass-merchant
rocklight124
An Avenger
Um not sure, because Cobalt said it's a test. And he already said it doesn't quite work well in the engine.
Chezi
Co-Lead Sonic Robo Smash Dev
That sort of implies loops (you can see the gravity change and it only works with spin dashing), but this never implied wall running
Chariman
Member
cookiefonster
Wiki Admin
Loop discourse is silly, loops are obviously infeasible in SRB2 unless MAYBE it were to move away from the Doom engine, and even then it's debatable at best.
That said, this thread provides an interesting criticism. It's true that SRB2 has a ground speed cap (if you're not spinning) that makes gameplay awkward at times, and while SRB2 undoubtedly has room for improvement in terms of momentum, the game absolutely excels at the exploration side of things. I consider exploration to be integral to making a fun Sonic game just as much as exhilarating speed-based gameplay.
SRB2 does have a few sections where speed is rewarded through shortcuts, which the 2D Sonic games are rife with. For instance, there's the slope early on in THZ2 that, if you spindash up it or go up with speed shoes and then jump, you can make it straight up to the bridge and skip the pusher platforming section. That's exactly the sort of clever tricks that I'd love to see SRB2 have more of. A physics revamp would certainly make such tricks easier to incorporate into levels.
That said, this thread provides an interesting criticism. It's true that SRB2 has a ground speed cap (if you're not spinning) that makes gameplay awkward at times, and while SRB2 undoubtedly has room for improvement in terms of momentum, the game absolutely excels at the exploration side of things. I consider exploration to be integral to making a fun Sonic game just as much as exhilarating speed-based gameplay.
SRB2 does have a few sections where speed is rewarded through shortcuts, which the 2D Sonic games are rife with. For instance, there's the slope early on in THZ2 that, if you spindash up it or go up with speed shoes and then jump, you can make it straight up to the bridge and skip the pusher platforming section. That's exactly the sort of clever tricks that I'd love to see SRB2 have more of. A physics revamp would certainly make such tricks easier to incorporate into levels.
Chariman
Member
The truth is that it would be great.
Although yes, I still miss the loops, but I can experience it with official sonic 3d or the other fangames
Mr Kixx Reborn
Let's give it all we got!
Yeah it sucks we don't have loops, but sadly that's how it is. This game is made off of the doom engine and doom wasn't really good with handling walls.
Augus
Member
Sonic Adventure did have a handful of unscripted half-loops, which is at least something.
Chezi
Co-Lead Sonic Robo Smash Dev
From what I can tell, that was half scripted. It looked like it autocorrected Sonic’s angle, which is kinda what happens in modern games