Does anyone know where the claim that this is "an art community" came from?

[Enes2gamer]

I don't really want to see you going off like that again so I am going to ban you for the time being. Acting like this sucks, man.

woah woah woah, what??
Why ban? I understand disagreeing with his opinion, but he didn't seem to actually be doing anything harmful by saying his opinion. Some of his behavior here was a bit extreme, but I'd understand giving a warning about that, but this? Bandder's not even really involved in the community anymore too, so this couldn't even really lead to anything. If anything, I've seen way more incriminating opinions on site. This is just odd.

 

[time gear]

This aged immaculately

That's rather surprising. Is there any information about why they were banned? I honestly didn't see any reason for it to go that far.

 

[ladno2023]

Art is art, regardless of the tools that are used to create the art. From paints and brushes to the written word. If one is creating something using the tools they have, then it's art. Indeed there are forms OF art, such as code, spriting, mapping, sound design, musical compositions etc, but they do fall all under the broad term of art. One can indeed be specific about the art they create, but they're all defined as an art form.

Much of the staff, as in virtually all members of staff, believe in what themselves and the community does is creating art and therefore all believe that each creation that we all make deserve respect in some form. Even if you don't necessarily like it and you are indeed allowed to make a mature and critical take on whatever is made.

But it's still art. They still took the time to create the thing like it's definitely still an art regardless of anything lol.

What you seem to miss @Bandder is that nobody is using the word "art" in any way other than...the literal definition of the word. Like just tell Google to define art and it will tell you it's a noun that means "the expression or application of human creative skill and imagination" and "the various branches of creative activity". Using the word in this way isn't unusual in any way at all.

So acting like there's any other definition or that we need to lower the definition outside of what it is as if the word is some kind of golden word while also getting snippy with others is, to put it frank, really fucking silly.

I don't really want to see you going off like that again so I am going to ban you for the time being. Acting like this sucks, man.

crackhead got mad because of the word art was interpreted differently
your lilac conservatory remake fucking sucks btw

 

[*GOOFYRAT!*]

crackhead got mad because of the word art was interpreted differently
your lilac conservatory remake fucking sucks btw

Mate, that wasn't fucking necessary. Maybe if you shut your Sonic 2 bumper lookin ass up and didn't just get mad because you lose a argument or are too annoying to earn a cookie from your mom's cookie jar all the time, maybe you would say something different.
You don't know in the god damn S L I G H T E S T how hard making maps is. Try it yourself, actually. Maybe you won't be such a pain in the arse after.
(O made it funnier, lmao-)

 

[cheeseboi.]

i’m actually fed up of controversies on here, this is literally a fangame about a fast hedgehog

 

[ladno2023]

Mate, that wasn't fucking necessary. Maybe if you shut your Sonic 2 bumper lookin ass up and didn't just get mad because you lose a argument or are too annoying to earn a cookie from your mom's cookie jar all the time, maybe you would say something different.
You don't know in the god damn S L I G H T E S T how hard making maps is. Try it yourself, actually. Maybe you won't be such a pain in the arse after.
(O made it funnier, lmao-)

>idk how hard making maps is
True. Making actually GOOD maps is hard, and roykirbs did not deliver at all with this one. All this map has is exaggerated slopes that look bad, HUUUUGE open spaces (that won't fit your ass) with absolutely nothing to do than just walk and navigation problems, mostly at the end lol.

First try doing a proper map with unique gameplay (other than just walk), without big ass spaces sith nothing in them, and slopes that are actually useful and integrated in the level itself, and then I'll see how you succeeded. As for now shut up lmao

 

[Grayvy Guy]

What you seem to miss @Bandder is that nobody is using the word "art" in any way other than...the literal definition of the word. Like just tell Google to define art and it will tell you it's a noun that means "the expression or application of human creative skill and imagination" and "the various branches of creative activity". Using the word in this way isn't unusual in any way at all.

So acting like there's any other definition or that we need to lower the definition outside of what it is as if the word is some kind of golden word while also getting snippy with others is, to put it frank, really fucking silly.

I don't really want to see you going off like that again so I am going to ban you for the time being. Acting like this sucks, man.

Well this is very very extreme. And by all reasons it's thought processes like this that have me hessitant to really post or comment much on things here. Bandders definitely hard on their opinion but if anything he did have genuine concern over things and to be frank the explaination here seems to completely misunderstand the opinion he has been conveying.

It's not so much the definition rather the context of what the word is being used here. I've only been lurking around some places and seeing things of this and that nature and quite frankly I'm of similar opinion that the use of the word "art" as a descriptor has sounded pretty pretentious and ridiculous in how it has been used. To stress again, the context of the words use and not the definition.

Of course there's art in the craft which I think is a term that should be more well adopted and tasteful to the fact that SRB2 is a video game (at least imo). Not all video games are necessarily art nor are all the processes to go into making them.

Art is art, regardless of the tools that are used to create the art.

This right here is where a lot of stuff falls apart. The definition is there, art is something that expresses a thing but the context implies the using of anything can be art... Including A.I. which if I recall correctly is very much disparraged in a lot of art circles.

The ignorance of phrases like that as well as being collectively called "an art community" doesn't really elicit a lot of positive thoughts and is definitely going to become a detriment if insisted for so long. Almost as bad as the social media mindsets that push for certain cultures to succeed and push anything counter intuitive to those cultures as horrible, regardless if the culture in question is bigotted or not.

I get this is a topic people higher up are tired of but at least be the heads of the community people expect and don't lose your head to someone just as stern. I managed a tournament for a game called Unfinished Dream of All Living Ghost where one participant was very frustrating to deal with, but I never banned them because they weren't directly harming or harassing anyone directly.

 

[*GOOFYRAT!*]

>idk how hard making maps is
True. Making actually GOOD maps is hard, and roykirbs did not deliver at all with this one. All this map has is exaggerated slopes that look bad, HUUUUGE open spaces (that won't fit your ass) with absolutely nothing to do than just walk and navigation problems, mostly at the end lol.

First try doing a proper map with unique gameplay (other than just walk), without big ass spaces sith nothing in them, and slopes that are actually useful and integrated in the level itself, and then I'll see how you succeeded. As for now shut up lmao

(Ngl I wish I could make a map with my ass computer lmao-)

 

[Bartz]

I'd like to remind everyone that there wasn't and still isn't a objective "right" or "wrong" side of this argument. But this ban makes it seem like there is, which is not the case of course.

 

[Lemerksdagaming]

Dam, yall created a huge argument , even got someone banned but still didn't answer the question

 

[soupnuts6061]

what an excellent community, you dare criticize the moderators and voice your opinion? whoops! banned! peak moderation right here folks! honestly this community sucks, we're evolving backwards

 

[C.D. Dinosaur]

what an excellent community, you dare criticize the moderators and voice your opinion? whoops! banned! peak moderation right here folks! honestly this community sucks, we're evolving backwards

there's "voicing your opinion" and then there's "implying any differing opinion is the result of a psy op on the part of the moderation team, a group of entitled assholes who rule with an iron fist"

just because moderators and other staff are the most common recipient of shit flinging does not mean you wouldn't also be banned saying the same thing to anyone else

 

[Avalice]

You don't know in the god damn S L I G H T E S T how hard making maps is. Try it yourself, actually. Maybe you won't be such a pain in the arse after.
(O made it funnier, lmao-)

I mean you don't make maps either. I do, and it's not TOO difficult. I'm also not the greatest fan of Lilac Conservatory either I think some of the points ladno made in his later post hold up to some of my opinions on the level. BUT it certainly has some effort put into it, so there's that.

 

[time gear]

there's "voicing your opinion" and then there's "implying any differing opinion is the result of a psy op on the part of the moderation team, a group of entitled assholes who rule with an iron fist"

Yes, there certainly is a distinction to be made here, and it seems implied that the ban is a temporary one, but it still seems strange that they moved straight to a ban rather than giving them some kind of warning to change their behavior first. If anything, the ban is likely to just reinforce their misplaced belief and feeling of being oppressed and add credibility to their argument that dissenting viewpoints aren't tolerated. I'm sure the moderation team likely has background reasons for the ban that we don't get to see, but because we don't get to see it unless and until they decide to share it's already having the effect of making people think that dissenting voices will be silenced.

This is why I think it would be a good idea for the team to share a little transparency with us. Giving us their viewpoint on why they made the choice they did could provide critical context that we are missing, and could resolve any potential misunderstandings.

 

[Sls64LGamingBro]

what an excellent community, you dare criticize the moderators and voice your opinion? whoops! banned! peak moderation right here folks! honestly this community sucks, we're evolving backwards

just because moderators and other staff are the most common recipient of shit flinging does not mean you wouldn't also be banned saying the same thing to anyone else

Yes, there certainly is a distinction to be made here, and it seems implied that the ban is a temporary one, but it still seems strange that they moved straight to a ban rather than giving them some kind of warning to change their behavior first. If anything, the ban is likely to just reinforce their misplaced belief and feeling of being oppressed and add credibility to their argument that dissenting viewpoints aren't tolerated. I'm sure the moderation team likely has background reasons for the ban that we don't get to see, but because we don't get to see it unless and until they decide to share it's already having the effect of making people think that dissenting voices will be silenced.

This is why I think it would be a good idea for the team to share a little transparency with us. Giving us their viewpoint on why they made the choice they did could provide critical context that we are missing, and could resolve any potential misunderstandings.

I mean, at this point. When we go off-topic, we criticize each other and debate about things that we aren't supposed to be talking about, when this thread's name is on there. Sometimes it can happen depending on where the conversation any thread goes. Likely due to how much drama can cause conflicts in a conversation to blow up.

It's mostly stressful, and I can say that honestly. The community doesn't suck, it's overwhelming people to go crazy about it. People's attitudes change because they're not going through what a person is saying by its definition, or they just wanna give up and wanna be banished from the community entirely.

All of this causes the community to despair and rather not stay here, or heck, they could even leave and never come back to the game ever. It's difficult for people to stay in all because they're conflicted with a conversation that has started. Plus, this doesn't make anything better when that person gets banned, probably because their attitude quite literally does not match the tone of what they were saying earlier. And could end up being fed up with them conversating about this. Then would get banned afterward.

This needs to STOP and if not, then the community won't shape itself up. I know this is dumb of me to reply about this, but it's something that needs to be DONE, because who knows if this won't get the community in any sense of context. I mean, it's the staff's choice whether they will or won't.

I'll likely take a break from this community, but there might be a chance I'll leave it entirely if this gets worse. Because I don't wanna. SRB2 has always had a share of creativity and imagination. I don't know how to end this message, but if the community won't bring it together. Then it will probably be a bad future for SRB2 itself. And with a few staff leaving the community and the game, it will probably be less till it keeps going (I don't know if that will happen in any way, but it's gonna happen to some people who were a part of STJR, now leaving the team). I might be going crazy about this btw, but that's what I have to say.

Feel free to reply to this.

 

[Banjo268]

For some reason my post didn't actually get posted, so I'm now stuck rewriting this. Yay.

My two cents (for what it's worth) is that most people think of art as drawings or animations. If you go down a street and show someone SRB2, The Mona Lisa, and Monster's Inc., my bet is that only 1 or maybe 2 of those options would people call art. I know this might sound unfair, since we're taking someone who's not in the SRB2 circle and making them judge it, but I'm trying to just say something. I respect the effort put into both vanilla and modded content here. I respect mods and fangames from all corners of the gaming sphere (or at least the ones I'm in). I can see the beautiful sprites, catchy music, and great level design at work in these mods. It can be called art and I wouldn't disagree. But when I think of the term "art community", I think of people drawing things primarily, not a modding community. I'm not saying things aren't works of art, but to say we're first and foremost an art community does sound a little pretentious. To me, it sounds like you're saying, "we're on the same level of art circles with experienced and professionals who do this for a living!". I don't mean to offend anyone here, but responding to the question "what is SRB2" with "an art community" doesn't line up personally.

"Sonic Robo Blast 2 is a 3D open-source Sonic the Hedgehog fangame built using a modified version of the Doom Legacy port of Doom. SRB2 is closely inspired by the original Sonic games from the Sega Genesis, and attempts to recreate the design in 3D. While SRB2 isn't fully completed, it already features tons of levels, enemies, speed, and quite a lot of the fun that the original Sonic games provided."

is a much better description than:

"Sonic Robo Blast 2 is an art community centered around an unfinished Sonic fangame inside a modified Doom engine. We strive to build each other up and make different works of art to push ourselves creatively. While the game isn't finished, we have a team working hard to complete and have many mods for our members to enjoy."

A tl;dr is that art is subjective, but claiming first and foremost we're an "art community" doesn't sound right.

 

[C.D. Dinosaur]

to say we're first and foremost an art community does sound a little pretentious. To me, it sounds like you're saying, "we're on the same level of art circles with experienced and professionals who do this for a living!"

a few things:
-srb2 and the srb2 community are two different things. You can enjoy one without the other, and vise versa. the people in charge of one and the people in charge of the other certainly have overlap, but they are not the same. it is both true that srb2 is a fan game built off doom legacy and that the srb2 community is an art community
-the idea that defining something as art is being pretentious is... kind of confounding to me? Since when was "art" a term only to be applied to "professionals?" Just because something is art doesn't mean it needs to be heralded as beautiful, or even good! "Art" isn't a compliment, it doesn't say anything about the work itself inherently beyond "somebody made this"
-"we strive to build each other up and push ourselves creatively" isn't some kind of community mantra or agenda, it's just... what artists do? hell, ignoring the second part, it's just, the concept of being kind and respectful? someone in theory anyone should be when interacting with another person in general? What kind of community wouldn't try to be supportive to its own members?

 

[*GOOFYRAT!*]

I mean you don't make maps either. I do, and it's not TOO difficult. I'm also not the greatest fan of Lilac Conservatory either I think some of the points ladno made in his later post hold up to some of my opinions on the level. BUT it certainly has some effort put into it, so there's that.

Good point. I DO wanna try tho. I literally only watch the BARE MINIMUM of map makin videos, and I can't understand a lick of it.

 

[ChaseSP]

Mate, that wasn't fucking necessary. Maybe if you shut your Sonic 2 bumper lookin ass up and didn't just get mad because you lose a argument or are too annoying to earn a cookie from your mom's cookie jar all the time, maybe you would say something different.
You don't know in the god damn S L I G H T E S T how hard making maps is. Try it yourself, actually. Maybe you won't be such a pain in the arse after.
(O made it funnier, lmao-)

This kind of behavior isn't appropriate, regardless of the other person said this just brings you down to their own level.

 

[*GOOFYRAT!*]

This kind of behavior isn't appropriate, regardless of the other person said this just brings you down to their own level.

Yea, and I apologize for it. (I think I already did, but dunno.)