Confusion of the Zelda timeline
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The continuity doesn't really seem to be one of the focuses of the game so its easy for things to be confused. Here's how I understand the Zelda continuity...
I'm not counting any of the games before OoT because I know very little about them. The first would be Ocarina of Time, Young Link leaves the kokiri and helps Zelda to secure the triforce but instead Gannondorf gets it and so the gifts of the triforce are bestowed on each of the three (and remain as such for the rest of the timeline) After Gannondorf's defeat he goes back in time and they prevent it all from happening causing two distinct timelines, one of which is followed by the Wind Waker, and the other Twilight Princess.
Plotholes I've found just from playing TP was however...
1. Gannondorf would have had to escape again to terrorize the sages... It could not be the scene hinted at the end of OoT because Saria, Ruto, Impaz etc. were not displayed and going by the explanation it didn't seem possible that this was the same occurrence.
2. Geography seems to have changed drastically, however this could probably be easily blamed on the mirroring of the Wii version. The map in the GC version is probably the accurate one. There are also other but more minor differences like the Forest Temple apparently becoming the Temple of Time and the King's grave at Kakakiro becoming the Zora's shrine etc.
3. The resting place for the Master Sword has changed and is now back in the lost woods, if the TP storyline follows from the events of young link, then the Master Sword would never have been touched.
I'm not counting any of the games before OoT because I know very little about them. The first would be Ocarina of Time, Young Link leaves the kokiri and helps Zelda to secure the triforce but instead Gannondorf gets it and so the gifts of the triforce are bestowed on each of the three (and remain as such for the rest of the timeline) After Gannondorf's defeat he goes back in time and they prevent it all from happening causing two distinct timelines, one of which is followed by the Wind Waker, and the other Twilight Princess.
Plotholes I've found just from playing TP was however...
1. Gannondorf would have had to escape again to terrorize the sages... It could not be the scene hinted at the end of OoT because Saria, Ruto, Impaz etc. were not displayed and going by the explanation it didn't seem possible that this was the same occurrence.
2. Geography seems to have changed drastically, however this could probably be easily blamed on the mirroring of the Wii version. The map in the GC version is probably the accurate one. There are also other but more minor differences like the Forest Temple apparently becoming the Temple of Time and the King's grave at Kakakiro becoming the Zora's shrine etc.
3. The resting place for the Master Sword has changed and is now back in the lost woods, if the TP storyline follows from the events of young link, then the Master Sword would never have been touched.
Dr.Pepper
Member
There's a problem with that, if they changed the future so that nothing ever happened, legends of the hero time would never have existed in the Wind Waker story, which was told in the very beginning of the game. Wind Waker takes place long into the future, to the point that the original Link is no longer alive. (Wind Waker is just a 'kid friendly' spin off of the Zelda series anyway, so it doesn't count, to me anyway.)JEV3 said:
Nintendo always has to remake the story every time they tell it, and they usually change the geography as well. Playing through the same Hyrule overworld from 'A Link to the Past' in the Ocarina of Time would get old quick.JEV3 said:
From what I can tell, the Hyrule capital could have moved since Link was a kid in OoT, leaving the Temple of Time a good 7 or more years(They don't say how old Link is in TP) to fall into disrepair and allow the forest to grow around it. Of course, Nintendo retells things so different with every game, this theory may not hold any water. Nintendo just loves to confuse their gamers, don't they?JEV3 said:
That's just my two cents, I've been playing Zelda games since the first title.
DanteEX
___________.
The only Zelda games I know that connect are:
Ocarina of Time > Majora's Mask
Legend of Zelda > Adventure of Link
Wind Waker > Phantom Hourglass
Minish Cap > Fourswords (In a way, but not exactly.)
The Oracle games probably don't connect, because the dungeons Labrynna are different in each game due to one being action-oriented and the other puzzle-oriented. So they could take place at the same time, but be in different dimensions. Just like how Termina is like the alter-dimension of Hyrule. Also, I agree that Minish Cap is the first game since Link got his signature cap and his young appearance. This might even be the first Link and Zelda ever.
Ocarina of Time > Majora's Mask
Legend of Zelda > Adventure of Link
Wind Waker > Phantom Hourglass
Minish Cap > Fourswords (In a way, but not exactly.)
The Oracle games probably don't connect, because the dungeons Labrynna are different in each game due to one being action-oriented and the other puzzle-oriented. So they could take place at the same time, but be in different dimensions. Just like how Termina is like the alter-dimension of Hyrule. Also, I agree that Minish Cap is the first game since Link got his signature cap and his young appearance. This might even be the first Link and Zelda ever.
LOL O HAY IMMA POST MY THEORY NOW!
I'm sure we can all guess Minish Cap is the prelude, the timeline then seems to split at OoT via alternate universe theory. One timeline, Ganondorf rises to power, and gets his ass kicked straight to the sacred realm. Centuries pass, Castle Town moves, Hyrule gets covered in colored lighting and bloom effects, Twilight Princess happens. The other timeline, Link stops Ganondorf from getting the Triforce of power by never opening the door of time, he runs off to do Majora's Mask, Ganondorf comes back, Hyrule floods. Link starts trying to sail back to Hyrule, but fails as it's flooded now, Link's Awakening happens. Centuries pass, Wind Waker happens, then whatever happens to link Wind Waker to Phantom Hourglass, happens.
Still not totally sure how the Oracle games, Link to the Past, and Zeldas 1&2 fit into all this. Someone care to offer up an explanation?
I'm sure we can all guess Minish Cap is the prelude, the timeline then seems to split at OoT via alternate universe theory. One timeline, Ganondorf rises to power, and gets his ass kicked straight to the sacred realm. Centuries pass, Castle Town moves, Hyrule gets covered in colored lighting and bloom effects, Twilight Princess happens. The other timeline, Link stops Ganondorf from getting the Triforce of power by never opening the door of time, he runs off to do Majora's Mask, Ganondorf comes back, Hyrule floods. Link starts trying to sail back to Hyrule, but fails as it's flooded now, Link's Awakening happens. Centuries pass, Wind Waker happens, then whatever happens to link Wind Waker to Phantom Hourglass, happens.
Still not totally sure how the Oracle games, Link to the Past, and Zeldas 1&2 fit into all this. Someone care to offer up an explanation?
Dr.Pepper
Member
I like your theory Draykon, but you're trying to 'link' Links Awakening with games that were made long after it's release, and LA was made kind of as a sequel to A Link to the Past. OoT completely remade the original story in ALttP, so I don't see how Links Awakening could fit into the picture. Also, like I said before, in the beginning of Wind Waker, the intro talks about how the people were praying for the Hero of Time to return, but he never did and Ganondorf overran Hyrule, then the gods flooded the land. How could the people of Hyrule know about the Hero of Time if Link had created an alternate time line, where he would have never done such deeds to obtain such a great title?
The story writers at Nintendo don't usually connect their stories between different 'remakes' of their games, so most of them are rather self-contained in that manner. Trying to piece them all together will only leave your head spinning. The only Zelda games that you could safely patch together would be either Zelda 1 to 2, ALttP to LA to Oracles, or OoT to MM to TP. Wind Waker is just a cheesy light hearted spin off intended for a much younger audience, so don't bother trying to bring it into the picture.
The story writers at Nintendo don't usually connect their stories between different 'remakes' of their games, so most of them are rather self-contained in that manner. Trying to piece them all together will only leave your head spinning. The only Zelda games that you could safely patch together would be either Zelda 1 to 2, ALttP to LA to Oracles, or OoT to MM to TP. Wind Waker is just a cheesy light hearted spin off intended for a much younger audience, so don't bother trying to bring it into the picture.
Chaos Knux
Daww, a mother and her foal
Dr.Pepper
Member
That video did a excellent job of bringing most of the games together, and I can see TP fitting nicely into the beginning of the second time line, 'b' mentioned in the video. So the Link we saw in TP was actually from a time line totally different from MM and all of the other Zelda games before it. Unless Nintendo says different or a better theory is presented, this is the best explanation of the Zelda time line that we have. The stories go a lot deeper than I ever thought.
Chaos Knux
Daww, a mother and her foal
Yes, right in the first cutscene. Link's boss (I think) aked him to go to Hyrule in his stead, commenting on how it was THAT Link's first time to see Hyrule.
It wasn't the same Link physically but it was same spirit of this hero. Tetra didn't know she was the princess Zelda until partway through the game, likewise, the young man in Twilight Princess only later discovered that he possessed the spirit of the hero of time. He was seeing Hyrule for his first time because it wasn't the same physical Link from any of the other games.
Also I've always considered that the Wind Waker timeline would from now on be represented by the cel-shading, if they are using that as an indicator than TP definitely fits into "Hyrule A" mentioned in the video. Like Wind Waker, its backstory seems to indicate an event not actually seen in any other games where Gannondorf was caught and expelled to the Twilight Realm, it also shows a band of thieves trying to take the triforce and being banished by the spirits of light to the Twilight Realm.
This really could have happened at any time, but the fact that Ganon almost always is the one behind everything makes me think that he was involved, also given Midna's orange hair, perhaps they were also Gerudos. (I'm sure their tradition would have changed once they were banished). Gannondorf was also not physically defeated by Link in the backstory so perhaps it is possible that this assault on the triforce took place directly after Ocarina of Time in "Hyrule A". (note: its also possible he could have reincarnated like Link and Zelda... because of the triforce, their spirits continue to re-appear from time to time, timeless heroes and villain)
Also if it didn't immediately take place afterwards it would allow for the changing of Hyrule, where Castle Town was built on the other side of Death Mountain and Zora's Domain was moved, and the land of the Kokiri has, by all appearances, disappeared.
As for the sages' change in appearance it could be that they decided to hide their physical shape but for a cloak and a mask because of a certain event. This event could have been the attack on the Sacred Realm or it could have been something else. Perhaps also they were different sages entirely but like the bearers of the triforce their spirits are timeless but their physical form was still corruptible, and the reason for their masking was merely a change in tradition. After all, if Zelda is allowed to have brown hair... (it looks better that way, just my opinion)
Also I've always considered that the Wind Waker timeline would from now on be represented by the cel-shading, if they are using that as an indicator than TP definitely fits into "Hyrule A" mentioned in the video. Like Wind Waker, its backstory seems to indicate an event not actually seen in any other games where Gannondorf was caught and expelled to the Twilight Realm, it also shows a band of thieves trying to take the triforce and being banished by the spirits of light to the Twilight Realm.
This really could have happened at any time, but the fact that Ganon almost always is the one behind everything makes me think that he was involved, also given Midna's orange hair, perhaps they were also Gerudos. (I'm sure their tradition would have changed once they were banished). Gannondorf was also not physically defeated by Link in the backstory so perhaps it is possible that this assault on the triforce took place directly after Ocarina of Time in "Hyrule A". (note: its also possible he could have reincarnated like Link and Zelda... because of the triforce, their spirits continue to re-appear from time to time, timeless heroes and villain)
Also if it didn't immediately take place afterwards it would allow for the changing of Hyrule, where Castle Town was built on the other side of Death Mountain and Zora's Domain was moved, and the land of the Kokiri has, by all appearances, disappeared.
As for the sages' change in appearance it could be that they decided to hide their physical shape but for a cloak and a mask because of a certain event. This event could have been the attack on the Sacred Realm or it could have been something else. Perhaps also they were different sages entirely but like the bearers of the triforce their spirits are timeless but their physical form was still corruptible, and the reason for their masking was merely a change in tradition. After all, if Zelda is allowed to have brown hair... (it looks better that way, just my opinion)
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