Analog control during online play in next version?

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CGally

CGally

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I played SRB2 over LAN with my younger brother a couple weekends ago, as part of a deal (I'd watch a movie with him, he'd play a game or two with me). Well, he didn't think the game was that bad, but he really hated the control. Playing with him, I could tell the movement was awkward for him, and I knew analog control would have suited him much better.

Is analog control during online play a priority for v1.09? I hope so. It's something this game's online really needs. I'm a firm believer that barring compromise of creator's vision (which is something that gets to me), games should be made as accessable as possible. That meaning easy to learn, easy to control, and not obtuse. I'd like to see this play control issue fixed in the next version if possible.
 
I *WISH*.

Unfortunatley STJr probably could have implemented it already, had they actually wanted to. So it looks like we're stuck without it.

Or, hell, I could bug JTE to put that in the next SPMoves! It's brilliant! :roll:
 
I wonder how difficult it is to implement. I mean, does it involve transmitting information in a different fashion online? If so, that could be annoying to get around, except maybe the game could be programmed to "translate" the analog movements into the "Doom-style" movements, and then send that movement info over the network.

But I would like an official reply from Sonic Team Jr., if you guys don't mind. Is my idea a difficult thing to implement, or had you simply not gotten around to it yet with all the other things going on?
 
The main reason analog control is not accessible in netplay is because from what I understand, it would require a serious rewrite of the netcode, which as most of you already know, is already rather painfully bad.

You could try splitscreen mode, as that allows for both players to use analog, but I don't think it supports multiple joypads.

Analog control in netgames is not on the planned feature list for 1.09.
 
I figured it had something to do with how the game transmitted information over the net. Are you sure it can't be fixed via a workaround in which the game sends more "normal" information over the net, to "translate" the analog movements into the usual movement type?

But anyway, thanks for the official response, Mystic. Hopefully it'll be fixed by v1.1, because for a lot of people, awkward play control is a turn-off. I was able to learn the "Doom"-style controls and was overjoyed when I discovered the analog control feature (which IMO should either be on by default, or at least the game should remember if you had it on or not for next time you play), but a lot of people will be scared away by it. But if it's too difficult to fix, then I can't blame anyone for that.
 
Just play it with Quake-style controls (WASD + mouse) instead of trying to put up with either DOOM-style (forward, backward, turning) or analog style (which sucks enough anyway; you can't head left/right without rotating the camera...), since it's much better.

SRB2: unböring
 
Personally, I find the analog controls unusable because of how inprecise they are.

I suggest people try using WASD and the mouse for a bit, as it's an incredibly precise control scheme that works in netplay. It does take a bit of practice, but once you have it down, it's more precise than any analog option will ever be, because the camera doesn't factor into it, and as we all know, the camera is the devil ^_~
 
dude is DOUBT in Spanish.

What would require analog working in netplay would be for every player to have their own camera that is tracked along with them, since in analog, the movement is dependent on the position of the camera. Right now SRB2 only has two cameras. Making a camera for each player wouldn't be too hard, but I'm concerned about the consistency implications.
 
I shouldn't have said "Doom-style". You know what I mean. Left and right arrows (or A and D) for sidestep, etc.

My point is, the general public tends to find this awkward, and therefore it is a bad default choice for them. Analog controls probably work best for a public that either owns controllers or has possibly played emulators, or at least assumes that pushing a direction moves you in that direction. The key when making a game is to make it accessable to people so they pick up and play and enjoy it.

I have already picked up this game and I love it. But I want it to be able to reach a wider audience, and activating analog controls by default will help.

I know you're all well-meaning, but please stop assuming that I'm talking about my own difficulties with this game, which are easily solved. I'm trying to convince other people to try this game out, and I know they'll enjoy it if not for certain issues, the control issue being one of them. I tell everyone I show this game to, to start the game, THEN go into Options and set controls to analog. They want to know why you can't just set Analog Controls to On first, and why the game won't remember the setting. I want to know also; seems like that at least should be an easy fix, since we're not talking netcode here.

Please take this into consideration.
 
We know, but you must understand that using analog controls with a keyboard is suicide.

The reason WASD and the mouse is good is because it gives the player accurate control in turning by use of the mouse. I don't like the default controls in SRB2, myself, so I agree at some level that the defaults should be changed, I don't think it should be to analog.

Using analog with a keyboard gives you 8 potential directions, with a glitchy camera and a bunch of other problems, it becomes really almost impossible to play in analog mode without an analog controller. If you DO have an analog controller, analog mode is great, however, for the 90% of us who don't, analog mode is unplayable and futile to even try.

While Doom controls are not intuitive, they are at least consistant amongst everyone who tries to use them. As keyboard-only controls, anyone who uses them will have the same experience.

I agree with the idea of changing the defaults, because I think AJ is the only one who uses them, but changing to analog would give people the initial impression that our camera is worse than SEGA's official stuff, which is totally not the case when you play with the Doom controls.
 
Mystic said:
We know, but you must understand that using analog controls with a keyboard is suicide.

The reason WASD and the mouse is good is because it gives the player accurate control in turning by use of the mouse. I don't like the default controls in SRB2, myself, so I agree at some level that the defaults should be changed, I don't think it should be to analog.

Using analog with a keyboard gives you 8 potential directions, with a glitchy camera and a bunch of other problems, it becomes really almost impossible to play in analog mode without an analog controller. If you DO have an analog controller, analog mode is great, however, for the 90% of us who don't, analog mode is unplayable and futile to even try.

While Doom controls are not intuitive, they are at least consistant amongst everyone who tries to use them. As keyboard-only controls, anyone who uses them will have the same experience.

I agree with the idea of changing the defaults, because I think AJ is the only one who uses them, but changing to analog would give people the initial impression that our camera is worse than SEGA's official stuff, which is totally not the case when you play with the Doom controls.
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Thank you for the explanation Mystic. It's true, my younger brother and I both have analog controllers (Playstation controllers via USB ports, no less), but most people do not. So you have a very good point. A lot of people may well find the arrow key movement for analog controls to be awkward (I actually prefer that over arrow keys + mouse, but to each their own), and you are probably right in using Quake-style movement to appeal to the largest possible audience.

One more question: could you have v1.09 save if analog controls were set, so we didn't have to reactivate them every time we started the game?
 
Omega the Hedgehog said:
You could always have a variable that makes it so that either ALL of the players have analog or NONE of them do =P
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That doesn't make any sense - if they all had analog all on or not is irrelevant - they would still all need their own personal camera.

1.09 will probably save your analog preferences.

Analog was actually implemented only as a "look, we can do it" thing... much like the SA mode with its homing attack and lightspeed dashes.
 
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