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Old 04-08-2014   #41
Rex The Kitsune
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Originally Posted by Unknownlight View Post
Mystic, from your play testing, do you find that new players actually manage to find the special stage tokens? Most of them seem awfully well-hidden to me.
When I first played the game, I had no problem exploring and finding them easily.
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Old 04-08-2014   #42
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Originally Posted by Iceman404 View Post
Is ERZ exploding behind you?
It would be cool if there were some explosion things put in throughout the level and a bit of falling rubble, and during the countdown at the end there could be a camera script activated that shakes the camera, giving the illusion the ground is shaking. Then if you lost, something would crush you (maybe the ceiling?) and you would die. Dunno how that last part would work in Co-op though.
Just my two cents.

Last edited by Knux576; 04-08-2014 at 10:48 PM.
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Old 04-08-2014   #43
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Originally Posted by Unknownlight View Post
Mystic, from your play testing, do you find that new players actually manage to find the special stage tokens? Most of them seem awfully well-hidden to me.
This depends on the player. Some players are more exploration-minded and some players are more completion-minded. I think it's important to reward players who go out of their way to explore, and special stage tokens are one of our more hidden types of powerup, so it's important they present a significant reward even to new players.
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Old 04-08-2014   #44
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Mystic, from your play testing, do you find that new players actually manage to find the special stage tokens? Most of them seem awfully well-hidden to me.
Isn't that the intent? I mean, if you look at the other Sonic games, you'd notice that they tend to be rather hidden. Though, not all of them are really hidden, like one from DSZ1 and ERZ2, I believe.

Anyway, to my own opinions:
Spoiler: Warning: Contains unlockables
Greenflower Zone:
For an intro zone, these three levels aren't that bad. Though, GFZ1 is probably a bit too linear. As for the new tunnel at the end of GFZ1, frankly, it looks a bit tacky, even if it's supposed to be a "Look here! You need to go this way!"
And don't get me started on the whirlwind shield room. That's pretty hidden.

GFZ2 has gotten a couple aesthetic touch-ups with some slight modifications to the paths as well, though I still don't like the alternate path at the beginning. It's still too confusing. As for the split path at the end, I do like the outdoors feel to the lower path, but that's about it. The double usage of the springs is cool, but if you strafe away from the second spring, you have to go all the way back to the first, which wasn't an issue with the first set of diagonal springs.

GFZ3... *whistles* I think this might have gotten a bit too difficult. The laser attack is nice, sure, but it's a lot more devastating than it was before. The pinch mode? Unless you hit Eggman fast enough, it can become a bit tedious to even fight him in this phase due to the short window you have.


Techno Hill Zone:
Good lord this place got quite an overhaul. THZ1 looks a lot more industrial in the earlier parts of the level than it was before (I mean, glass barriers? Really? That just doesn't fit there). Though... the third to last checkpoint has a split path that seems to lead to a dead end on the left side, which is really annoying to new players (unless they're playing as Knuckles, but even then it's a bit confusing).

THZ2 has gotten an extension, which looks rather nice, but at the same time a little bit confusing, unless the player actually understands how the slime works from THZ1. Other than that, it's not too bad, minus the fact that the level feels a bit too long for an early level.

THZ3 is probably trivial compared to GFZ3 now with the glass windows, as the slime is the only thing that can hurt you, unless you count the spring below Eggman, which can hurt you... somehow.


Deep Sea Zone:
I still hate water levels, and this isn't that much of an exception. Especially since some paths are puzzle paths. Ugh. DSZ1 is filled with a bunch of open rooms with very little decor outside of the water areas, which is a bit weird. DSZ2 has less of a problem, but it's still rather easy to notice there as well.

DSZ2... well, I really don't know what to say. Personally I like this better than the first act, but that's not saying a whole lot. It's only better because there's a bit more pacing to the level.

DSZ3, if you're going for a fast time, is all about luck. Though, the fact that Eggman zaps the water twice when you're in it is really strange, as you're still invulnerable when the second one hits.
As for the pinch mode? Well... again, luck based, but if you're not afst enough on the 3rd hit, Eggman just drops after one shot, which can be a bit annoying.


Castle Eggman Zone:
CEZ1 starts you off with a huge pit, okay. Other than that, this level's quite ni--wait why is Knuckles' path so hard. His previous path from THZ1 was completely bland, and this one requires you to be nearly precise. And to top it all off? You can't see the spike ball coming at all unless you zoom the camera out.

CEZ2 has gotten quite a big extension since 2.0, which is nice, but the level feels a bit strange once you get into the library part of the level. I don't know about you, but seeing that there just feels a bit strange.

CEZ3 is a rather nice fight, but it's really slow at the same time. Also, I don't like the pinch phase at all. It's unclear what you're supposed to do, and if you mess up on the last hit and fall down, you're basically stuck down there.


Arid Canyon Zone:
All I have to say is, those ... things you have to ride on to get across is probably the WORST part of the level. Especially since you have to do about 12 of those over a death pit. Fortunately, you do have platforms below to la--god dammit I missed the jump to the next platform again. *sigh*

Yes, getting from platform to platform down there as Sonic is a biiiiit too hard.


Red Volcano Zone:
RVZ1 is still an interesting level, especially for where it's at. Personally, my only complaint is the fact that some of this stuff kinda blends in. Not as bad as GFZ2's alt path, but it's still there.

Also, standing on lava? You can't stand on water, so why are you able to stand on lava? That just doesn't make sense to me. Then again, I think that was intentional because otherwise you'd be constantly getting hit every 5-6 seconds in the lava.


Egg Rock Zone:
ERZ1 starts you off at a reasonable pace in terms of difficulty, though at certain points it can get a bit annoying, or even confusing. I don't really have much to say here, though.

ERZ2... oh man, talk about gauntlet. This level is probably the hardest one out of all the main levels. Though, I have to be honest, even though it's the last zone of the game, it might need a slight nerf in a couple areas.

As for the length of the level, personally I think it's fine. Though, if the level was any longer it would be too annoying.

ERZ3... ugh. While I do like the fact that this is here, I don't like it. The race is cool, but after that? Good luck, because Metal Sonic is a bit more unpredictable than he needs to be. He bounces around randomly, his attacks are random, and there's little way to actually dodge said attacks. The only one that can really be dodged is his pinball-like attack. The other two (or however many attacks he has) you can barely tell which one is going to be used, and even then, dodging them is a pain.

ERZ4, also known as ERCZ. In terms of final bosses, this is rather trivial compared to ERZ3, which I guess is alright considering that 2.0 was really confusing to me. If anything, the ring count should be lowered to 2 or 3.


Special Stages:
There are two things I'm curious about: Why use NiGHTS mechanics for the special stages? And why is it that whenever you take a hit, not only do you lose 5 seconds, but you lose an additional 2-3 seconds just to recover? That's a total of 7-8 seconds!


Floral Field:
This is quite a nice way to start off the special stages, as it gives the player an easy start to the levels, which is a good thing, especially since this level resembles GFZ.


Toxic Plateau:
Out of all the special stages, I like this one the most, but I'm not too sure why it stands out to me. Might be all the good aesthetics used in this level compared to the others.


Flooded Cove:
From the early-mid levels, this is probably one of the harder ones with some of its interesting mechanics that can throw people off. Though... just like DSZ, this level feels rather bland.


Cavern Fortress:
I like this level as well, especially since it has a really nice theme to it. Plus it's the first level to really introduce obstacles that can cause you to waste time (unless you count Flooded Cove's water mechanics towards the end, but those are hard to even get hit by). Though... this level feels way too similar to the circuit map that somehow escapes me. Slumber Circuit?


Dusty Wasteland:
Frankly, the name is kinda fitting, especially since this feels completely wasted by the fact that there's Spring Hill Zone as well... and this is basically that but retextured and with a much lower timelimit.


Magma Caves:
This is when the gauntlet really starts kicking in, as this is where you really have to pay attention to the surroundings. My only gripe here is the fact that the level is actually kinda slow, especially with the large room with the spinning fire.


Egg Satellite:
Ow. This one's a doozy, but I guess it kinda makes sense as the counterpart for this is ERZ. Fortunately it's not the hardest, but if you're not careful, this level can be really difficult. I do like this level, though, simply because it pushes your abilities.


Black Hole:
...No comment.


Spring Hill Zone:
There's not really much to say here, other than the fact that there's probably a slight bit more to explore in this level as normal Sonic.


"Hyper Stages":
Why are these called hyper stages?


Aerial Garden Zone:
After putting off completing this as Sonic for years, I finally did it here. I have to be honest, though, this level is rather tedious, but even harder as Knuckles than Sonic or Tails, which is really weird. Might be because he's forced to go through a linear path. Not sure.


Azure Temple Zone:
...ow. As if DSZ was bad enough, this is even more tedious. Fortunately I saved my sanity by going through the gargoyle puzzle instead of the other room... but then again, this level pulls the SAME thing as DSZ: Puzzles. No other zone does this last I checked. Not even CEZ2.


SRB1 Remakes:
These are okay to go through if you just want something to pass the time. Though, I have to be honest, one of the levels is a LITTLE too hard, simply because you can't really see anything in one area. I can't remember which level, though.


Pipe Towers Zone:
Honestly, I liked the original SMB levels. This one is a lot harder, for one, and it's also a bit of a "what a secret?" type of level, as every secret ends up in a dead end.
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Old 04-09-2014   #45
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The trivial score requirement for getting continues is actually intentional. We want to encourage new players to try special stages on their first playthrough even though they aren't likely to get all the emeralds. Rewarding them with a continue for their attempt seems like a good reward for hunting down those special stage tokens.
That's fine and all, but I find it a little ridiculous that I can end a no-save game with five continues with minimal effort. None of the official special stages were that easy to get continues on. I think you should at least remove the one continue granted to the player by default.
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Old 04-09-2014   #46
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All Levels are good, but i expected that the 1st act of GFZ Will be Diffrent 7/10 ..
Special Stages :
Egg Satellite : i still think that it's so hard, and it's impossible to Record attack here 6/10 ...
Spring Hill Zone : Don't you think that the time is not enough to get the Time Emblem ??? and nothing change in the level so i'll just give it 4/10
DSZ 2 : The Beginning of the stage is better, i don't think you'll have to edit this stage 10/10
ACZ : The Level is good as it is, but some Parts of the level are useless..
GFZ1: (The Top of the Hill, Mountain or whatever is it) Wide open space, with little offres so this part is useless 7/10
THZ2: I Really love this new Act of THZ,But Bouncing all the time on this Pink Liquid is Killing me, Replacing it with a Damaging Liquid (Acid) Will be good
SRB1 Remake : Textures aren't appropriate for the 1st Level,use GFZROCK Textures ,they will make it Better
*There are no Bosses ?? What's that

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Old 05-16-2014   #47
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Time for a bump! This is perhaps not the best-written post in this thread by far, but I just wanted to get my opinions out.

Spoiler: Single Player

Greenflower Zone Act 1 - 4/10
+ does sort a good job of explaining the game, simple enough after 2.1 edits
- won't amaze any new players, very dated/ugly

Greenflower Zone Act 2 - 5/10
+ good amount of exploration, new outside part
- the large area near the end feels very empty, very dated/ugly

Greenflower Zone Act 3 - 7/10
+ perfectly fine first boss
- it isn't the most amazing boss, but it shouldn't be

Techno Hill Zone Act 1 - 6/10
+ the new gimmicks are great, much needed visual overhaul works quite well
- aside from the knuckles path the path splits are poor at best, the climbing on pipes segment is still terrible, the other path is more interesting but looks worse

Techno Hill Zone Act 2 - 9/10
+ nev3r wizardry (in other words, everything)
- needs a slight bit more polish, feels a bit incomplete

Techno Hill Zone Act 3 - 6/10
+ neat concept, plays well enough
- easier than the first boss, slime inconsistency

Deep Sea Zone Act 1 - 6/10
+ mostly good ideas/concepts, looks okay in some areas, enemies work well
- ugly for the most part, feels inconsistent and dated

Deep Sea Zone Act 2 - 5/10
+ mostly good ideas/concepts
- it's frankenstein: the level which makes it feel very inconsistent, looks quite ugly almost everywhere, the bustable block maze is terrible, feels dated and empty

Deep Sea Zone Act 3 - 8/10
+ neat concept, well-executed, those clones, beautiful arena
- the electric water could've been executed better, rocket spam in the pinch phase could be toned down

Castle Eggman Zone Act 1 - 3/10
+ chain gimmick, skybox, doesn't look completely bad I guess?
- feels very empty, boring, confusing at parts (lol lake area)

Castle Eggman Zone Act 2 - 6/10
+ challenge, gimmicks
- length, not the prettiest level, some areas feel empty or are boring (cannonball area, water level area)

Castle Eggman Zone Act 3 - 7/10
+ great concept, well executed
- pinch phase feels very lacking, no challenge whatsoever, arena could look a bit better

Arid Canyon Zone Act 1 - 8/10
+ nev3r wizardry
- floor crusher tunnel is terrible, polyobjects just don't work that well yet

Red Volcano Zone Act 1 - 7/10
+ looks neat for the most part, new badniks, great gimmicks (those upside down springs are the best, also the lava wave)
+ too short and easy for where it is in the game

Egg Rock Zone Act 1 - 8/10
+ gimmick paradise
- outer space areas feel empty, a bit too linear

Egg Rock Zone Act 2 - 9/10
+ nev3r wizardry, gimmick paradise
- shrinking area is frustrating, that one snailer in the megaman block room

Egg Rock Zone Act 3 - 7/10
+ great concept, well executed (although the race could maybe use more interactivity)
- a bit too difficult, reverse gravity part of the race is bad, pinch phase takes too long

Egg Rock Core Zone - 8/10
+ pretty awesome, skybox, great gimmicks and attacks
- sniper barrels could be slightly more obvious, brak eggman is still ugly as sin

Pipe Towers Zone - 8/10
+ best mario level ever
- some platforms have weird shapes which detract from the gameplay, item boxes feel clunky, goombas are terrible enemies

Aerial Garden Zone - 9/10
+ lengthy but not boring, tons of secrets and content, no jetty-syn spam like in mystic realm
- visual glitches (but those are probably unavoidable), that sky needs to be a fancy skybox

Azure Temple Zone - 10/10
+ completely awesome

I just can't care for the SRB1 remake, it's nice for legacy purposes but it's terrible level design. I need to play the special stages some more before I can properly comment on them, but I liked them quite a lot. They don't always look that good though.


And let's not forget the multiplayer levels! (seriously, you guys should play and rate them) Watch as I rate many of my own levels, with everything in italics being stuff I've made or contributed to.

Spoiler: CTF

Lime Forest Zone - 7/10
+ Better visuals, small stage = hectic gameplay
- Bases and underwater tunnels feel too cramped, the trees with items on seem pretty useless

Cloud Palace Zone - 5/10
+ Updated visuals, path variety
- Main path is just a straight line, some areas are too far away from it to feel useful, springs at the bases are weird

Silver Cascade Zone - 7/10
+ New visuals, path variety
- The jump to the flag room can be difficult with c-lag, bottleneck at the underwater blue springs, moving scenery distracts/gets in the way sometimes

Icicle Falls Zone - 8/10
+ Hectic, small yet balanced, new bases, looks amazing
- staircases to the upper area are a bit too tedious and break the flow, panels up there are too close together

Twisted Terminal Zone - 6/10
+ Gravity gimmick, updated visuals and flag rooms
- Zoom tube bottleneck, new side rooms under the bases are too useless, very flat level design

Clockwork Towers Zone - 9/10
+ theme, visuals, layout
- too many nooks and crannies, why did I make the central bridge half-broken


Molten Fissure Zone - 3/10
+ base design, item balance
- visuals are poor, level design is weird and dated, not spacious enough, central tunnels are confusing, staircase to upper area is too hidden

Radiant Caverns Zone - 7/10
+ theme and visuals of the bases, new textures, the red team water doesn't look like lava anymore
- everything about the center area, some items are too hidden/far away, some tunnels and areas are way too small
(especially near the flag room)

Iron Turret Zone - 7/10
+ not-flat center area and the new layout in general, new THZ1-esque theme and slime, new flag rooms
- stuff gets in the way too much sometimes (especially in the storage rooms and the cave paths), bases feel a bit too small

Dual Fortress Zone - 7/10
+ theme/visuals, new layout for the most part
- we desperately need better brick textures and not mix the brown ones with the grey ones, water tunnel is very empty and ugly, bit too many areas and paths


Nimbus Ruins Zone - 8/10
+ unique gameplay, no overdecoration, balancing
- hard to play with c-lag


Spoiler: Match

Jade Valley Zone - 7/10
+ size, well interconnected layout, item balance
- GFZROCK without multiples of 64 makes me cry, visuals, some areas are a bit too small, feels a bit too same-y

Noxious Factory Zone - 5/10
+ new slime is well implemented, memorable layout with different areas, not too big
- bottleneck at the upper factory entrance, tunnels around the conveyor room are boring and small, item balance (lol 5 item boxes in the conveyor room), SRM gauntlet is a bit too difficult

Tidal Palace Zone - 8/10
+ tidal gimmick, visuals/theme, memorable and spacious layout with distinct areas, item balancing
- a bit too large for smaller netgames

Thunder Citadel Zone - 6/10
+ memorable layout, good balancing
- not really pretty, infinity ring tunnel/sewer is bad, underwater area feels lacking, a bit too large

Desolate Twilight Zone - 3/10
+ textures/theme, layout somewhat works
- thokthokthokthokthoktthokthokthokthok, bit too dull visually, those weird floating islands

Infernal Cavern Zone - 5/10
+ unique gameplay, risk vs. reward, visuals, item balance
- small yet hard to navigate/find people in, cramped, c-lag makes this very un-fun

Orbital Hangar Zone - 4/10
+ theme, visuals, item balance for the most part

- the working boss capsule isn't there anymore, too many ring boxes (conveyor belt room), the tails/knux tunnels are the most boring things ever, needs less clutter, not polished enough (too many texture/visual bugs aaa), level needs some interesting gimmicks

Frost Columns Zone - 8/10
+ new textures, item rebalancing, great visuals, great and memorable layout
- the ice ruins are a bit too blinding with the colormap, it feels a bit small in there

Granite Lake Zone - 4/10
+ the visuals work, item balance is okay
- layout is too large and the visuals are the same everywhere, making it hard to navigate and find people in, many areas feel incomplete and empty

Diamond Blizzard Zone - 8/10
+ visuals, layout and path balance, item rebalancing, fixing of the broken bridges and tunnels
- some visual quirks here and there, ammo balance could use a bit more work, pipe room is terrible (lol kanji)


Celestial Sanctuary Zone - 8/10
+ theme, area variety, item balance
- some jumps are difficult (even more so with c-lag)

Sapphire Falls Zone - 5/10
+ it plays okay I guess
- thok barrier is sort of weird, needs better texture alignment, the large and deep pool leads to many annoying fights in Valve time, bit too small

Meadow Match Zone - 2/10
+ for some inexplicable reason it isn't complete garbage, infinity ring location
- thokfest, GFZ-texturing, basically everything
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Old 05-27-2014   #48
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I'll only rate the official levels, and the ones I've played:

GFZ1:
It's a Green Hill Zone level. Yuuuup. Nothing much to say, it gets you up to speed and it does the job but it's cramped. 5/10

GFZ2:
Better than the first act, a lot more room and easy to get a good feel going. Plus some platforming at the end and it feels a little more opened-up. 6/10

THZ1:
VERY nicely designed. This is fast-paced and yet still has some tricky platforming sections, definitely feels a lot more open than the previous two levels. My main complaint? The factory section at the end is too short. It's like "oh hey I'm in a factor--LEVEL OVER". 7/10

THZ2:
Uuuugh. This level isn't BAD, but it's absurdly long compared to the ones before. It'll take a newbie player up to 10 minutes to get through this thing, and worst of all it's not even difficult, it's just really goddamn long. In addition, far too much of the level feels like you're being escorted along one particular path. Finally, that section where you must ascend by dodging those blue blocks coming out of the wall is suffering, because if you screw up once (and the timing is very tight), you fall all the way to the bottom and have to spend a huge amount of time going back up.

HOWEVER...the slime gimmick is cool as hell, and once you know the stage it is very fun to speedrun. I'm giving it a 3/10 the first time around, but a 7/10 any subsequent times.

DSZ1:
Time for the water level. For a water level, it's surprisingly not rage-inducing. There's lots of alternate pathways and I like some of the more complex platforming seen in here. 7/10

DSZ2:
Oh man this level is a blast. Waterslides are fun as hell and this moves at a really good flow compared to the first one. Kinda wish more parts took place in the big cavern though, when I entered that via waterslide I was arrested for a second at that wondrous low-res vista.

Though why is one of the only slopes in the game in here? That waterslide section in the cavern has like the only slope in the game, and it works surprisingly well, but it's rather-out-of-place compared to all the other levels. Oh yeah, a rating...8/10. Thank god this was awesome...

CEZ1:
...because fuck this level. Easily my least favorite level in the game, this thing is just a travesty. It's a labyrinthine mess where it's impossible to figure out where you're going half the time. It's dark as hell so you can't so where you're going a lot (and that GODDAMN LAKE SECTION is so damn dark I have to turn my brightness up just to see where I'm going...except that part is so damn tortured that I don't know where I'm going). And should you somehow intuit where you need to go, get ready for some rage-inducing platforming.

Can I state once more how absurdly labyrinthine this level is? Lost Impact and The Doom in Shadow were less tortured than this stage. Screw this stage, I'll admit I'm shit at this game but AUUUUUGGHHH. 2/10

CEZ2:
HOLY SHIT A FUN LEVEL. Compared to the form of cruel and unusual torture that is CEZ1, this one is very fun. I'm biased because I love levels that take place inside a building with lots of little alternate paths, but this is just plain fun regardless. Sometimes it's a little linear, but compared to the first act this is crazy good. 7/10

ACZ:
I have played this level like once. It made barely any impression on me, besides the fact that about halfway through there is a part so confusing I spent three minutes going through all the paths and only winding up back at the beginning until I wanted to punch my computer screen. Also I cannot find a good Sonic Before/After The Sequel song to go on here 4/10.

RVZ:
BEST ZONE IN THE GAME. But seriously real talk this place is FUN AS HELL. So much flow and speed, you can fly through this stage but you have to really stay on your toes. There's a lot of platforming over dangerous areas (i.e lava) in this and I love that plus the falling stone platforms are really well designed--they fall so you have to move fast, but they also are big enough that you can run across them without stopping, and they all have unique shapes so they don't feel stale. My only complaints are the intermittent "lavafalls"--in a zone that has such a good flow, they completely grind you to a halt. I personally just plain HATE obstacles in Sonic that are intermittent and force you to stop like that, though, so maybe it's just me. Also that section with the spinning "flamethrowers" is suffering. Otherwise, amazing level. Even more amazing if you put Serious Influence from the Sonic After The Sequel Soundtrack on, DISCO VOLCANO YEEEEEEEEEAAHH. 10/10.

ERZ1:
I die a lot in this stage

Every new room has ways to murder me, and if they don't the camera in the inverted gravity sections will

Sometimes when I sleep, I look around, and I see the endless darkness of death pits staring into my soul


ERZ2:
>implying I can even get to this stage

Last edited by Frostav; 05-27-2014 at 12:59 AM.
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Old 05-27-2014   #49
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CEZ1: I don't think I would call it labyrinthine, the only problem is that one open room with the lake is lacking in direction. The rest is actually pretty straightforward.

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Sometimes when I sleep, I look around, and I see the endless darkness of death pits staring into my soul
lol. Enjoy ERZ3
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Old 05-27-2014   #50
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Maybe CEZ1 isn't as labyrinthine as I think, but I seriously have no clue how to go through and it every time I play it literally just stumble through it until I happen to meander onto the right path.

Christ I don't even know how to do the beginning, I just spindash off the ledges at the start onto the big forest path to their left

EDIT: Oh just checked and that's the path you're supposed to take. Huh.

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Old 05-27-2014   #51
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Though why is one of the only slopes in the game in here? That waterslide section in the cavern has like the only slope in the game, and it works surprisingly well, but it's rather-out-of-place compared to all the other levels.
It's not actually a "slope" technically - in fact it's really a lot of sectors arranged in a way to make it look like a slope. We used to have a much closer slope look-alike near the end of GFZ2, but in 2.1 that was replaced with stairs, so eh.
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Old 12-22-2015   #52
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This topic is over a year old at this point, but we're often lacking in decent feedback, so I'm bumping it to see if we can get some fresh opinions.
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Old 12-22-2015   #53
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Oh, I missed this thread from a year ago? oh okay.
Just gonna throw quick reviews of the firsts things going through my mind.

-- normal sp campaign thing --

GFZ1: Mostly okay, nothing very special about it. I still don't get the point of that area near the house, it's completly pointless to get up there. Put some goodies up there or something, rather than just a dumb floor somehow higher than the rest of that flat area thing.

GFZ2: Always liked this one, and 2.1 made it better. A lot of exploration to have, some wide opened level you can actually speed through.

GFZ3: I remember getting very confused the first time I played it; it's an extreme difficulty spike compared to GFZ in general, the first phase is okay and fair once you know what it is, but the pinch phase is irritating to say the least.

THZ1: yaaay; sunset and new slime! My only complaint is that Knux's path is more annoying than pleasing. I feel like it's just here to slow you down.

THZ2: you guys nailed it, mes bravos. However, it'd be good to have another path than the elevator to the end, it's super annoying in race, and coop in general, having to sit there waiting for it to go down again... Also, another pointless thing, that button, what's it purpose? Or rather, why was it left here?

THZ3: why does the slime hurt me??????
No, seriously, why? It's completly harmless for the first two acts and now it suddently hurts. My first reaction when I saw it was "hey, does it still hurt? =D" ...And, yeah, cheap trick.

DSZ1: The water nerf made the begining waaaay too easy. Also this level really is bland, damn, that area you can run through with the speed shoes on the upper path at the begining... However, I admire the multiple paths things, but I still think the gargoyle path should take you way farther in the level, it feels like an extreme punishement for exploring. Also you guys broke the spring chain >8C

DSZ2: Hey, the block maze actually isn't bullshit anymore! ...Somewhat! Not much to say on it again, still kinda bland on some places. Also the super waterslide ramp is broken, it doesn't stick my ass to it. But, good thing we don't have to take that zoomtube anymore when we screw up the water raising platform path, god.

DSZ3: Eggman dummies are annoying to identify at first. You should make a clear and fast to spot difference so you don't stay here dodging a wave of missiles before deciding to do your thing.

CEZ1: I like the graphic overhaul. But the level is still bland, especially the begining and the end. Also Knuckles' path gotta be a joke. It's a damn pain in the ass. It does nothing but slowing you down even more than THZ1 and making sure you go make a cam_dist bind in your autoexec JUST for it.

CEZ2: Was extremely LONG and ANNOYING to complete at my first try. I remember getting stuck as Sonic in that part with the chains where you have to keep going up near the end, inside the tower. On the other hand, the level's much better than its first act, way less bland and better to look at, even though the canonball and end sections could get visual overhauls.

CEZ3: That boss is boring, and sometimes unfair due to how fast it changes the maces rotation direction. Also, falling when the boss is ready to take the last hit... it's just unfair trying to get back up...

ACZ: Just as I remember it. And hey, no more random scrolling floors! =D
...But ... like GFZ1, the heck is the point of that area near the end? ...That whole part before the last checkpoint is very bland as whole TBH, I'd rather have some actual obstacles rather than just be willing to spinfly my way through there.

RVZ: rest in peace token shortcut, that new secret area is never gonna replace you ;(
The level as whole is extreme ass in coop mode; falling platforms EVERYWHERE without alternatives but falling in pits of lava that are pointlessly DEEP AS HELL if you happen to wonder if you can swim in decorative lava falls. Also this part with the springs pointing down the lava forcing you to do tricky jumps if you lost your whirlwind shield before.

ERZ1: I wonder who ever takes the right path. It's still way too long; and complicated than the left one. This aside; not a fan of how you removed the signs for Tails and Sonic on that path, it's because I remembered it but, I can easyly imagine a player thinking they can go on the crusher route while Tails is cleary too slow unless you get the sneakers behind. You also broke yet another spring chain >8C

ERZ2: Reverse the paths lenght issue above. Still a great level I enjoy playing minus the invisible sonic 2 lazer of doom due to OpenGL at the end. rest in peace cheap fan slide thing i will miss your awful dsz mines, pits, flamethrowers and lazers placement </3

ERZ3: It's awesome. The race was kinda hard at the first try, especially that platform section, but it's extremely easy to outspeed Metal as any character in the end, especially Tails, he literally wrecks his race time.
The fight itself however is kinda annoying; especially that DAMN PINCH PHASE. It's way too freaking long. I generally just end up intentionally getting hit by something to stand on the pillars on the side of the arena using the ledge collision due to how it annoys and bores me to keep strafing left and right to dodge him for this long, three times.

ERZC: Not much to say about it; pretty neat and amusing. dat knockback on the missles tho!

-- sp extra levels thing --

MKB: yay pipe towers! Not much to say, I'd really like to see the Koopa... Garison (I bet I spelt it wrong) merged with it in a 2 acts zone for future versions.
Anyway, I really like the level itself, it's very well built. My only complaint is the fact that most of the time, ? blocks only give out coins, which made me mostly ignore the few ones containing fire flowers. Thinking of power ups; it'd be nice if you implented actual Mario damage physics in this level.

NAGZ: The graphical overhaul's neat! ...Minus the awful visual errors!
Also thanksgod, there aren't damn bullet SINS everywhere.
...Glad you also removed that underwater section.

ATZ: My worst nightmare. It's very frustrating at time; like when I was flying with Tails in that section with the current that is supposed to help you getting over the pit; that went like "Nooope! Get into your fall frames, and fall into the pit! =D" Also Knuckles' path is about as good and enjoyable as CEZ1's.

No, no multiplayer reviews, because I only really care about singleplayer and coop when it comes to srb2.
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Old 12-23-2015   #54
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I suppose I will give this a shot, although I can't say I've played every level intensively as of yet.

I will only do the main single player levels for now; I may follow up with multiplayer levels and the extra stages at a later time.

Spoiler: Main levels and special stages
GFZ1: This level very clearly says "introductory level" to me. Simple, not too vast, no crazy things to look for. I like the addition of the room where the extra life currently is, it provides a nice baby tutorial of the Twister Shield. Some upper areas are a little lacking, but otherwise I'm pretty much fine with the level as is. (7.5/10)

GFZ2: This level is a very stark contrast to GFZ1, and I'd say it keeps me interested because it's the first level you can really explore, while not being too difficult either. I like the change to the end of the level as well, it looks nicer. (8/10)

GFZ3: This boss does more things than I would expect out of a first boss, and I love and hate it at the same time as a result. Not much to say otherwise, since the boss is still certainly easy, but I do question whether it's too difficult a first boss for a first timer. (7/10)

THZ1: This level got a makeover for 2.1, and it's amazing. Am I even looking at the same level anymore? My largest complaint is with the Knuckles path in this level. It really feels very forced, and not the most fun either. It feels more like a detour if anything. The other Knuckles paths in later levels at least have some challenge, but perhaps the lack of one here was semi-intended as an introduction? That said, this level's strengths certainly involve some high (and low) secrets. The slime is used to make some items a little more challenging to get, and I quite like that. The application of spring enemies is a nice touch, even if I don't particularly like using the enemies as springs when trying to go fast. (7.5/10, would be closer to a 9 not considering Knux path.)

THZ2: This level got huge, and it was quite intimidating on the first attempt as a result, considering I was used to older TH2s by now. After getting over that, though, there's just a lot to look at and do in here. I had fun looking for secrets and rings here. The elevator is a nice breather in the level, but it's not well built for other modes such as co-op. The ending of the level is nice as well, it feels like you're going down into something dark and mysterious. (8.5/10)

THZ3: I find this boss fun for the most part. Yes, all of a sudden the slime hurts you, but I'd just chalk that one up to an Eggman invention. Bit of an interesting choice to enclose the area, I found that intriguing the first time I played the level in 2.1. (8.5/10)

DSZ1: I haven't explored the full potential of Deep Sea as of yet, but for the most part it's still how I remember it, bar a few changes. That's not a bad thing, though, it's a fine level, but it's just not the most memorable level in the game. (6.5/10)

DSZ2: This level is one to get lost exploring in, and I do like that. There were some changes for the better, especially the water no longer rising in the room before the green dragon. I also quite like the secret hidden above the last part of the crusher bit. (8/10)

DSZ3: Wow, this boss changed, and not for the better. The last hit is borderline unfair, especially as Tails, because you have to act so quickly to hit Eggman for the last time...I dunno, I liked the older design better. I remember taking a solid 6 minutes on this boss because the pinch phase was that frustrating my first time. The Eggman clones are a nice idea, I'll certainly commend that, but sometimes it's just not easy to tell which is which quickly enough even if you know what to look for. (5.5/10)

CEZ1: I like the new changes to this level. It made a few things easier, and I think the level flows better compared to before. There are some nice secrets here as well. It was a bit of a letdown to see the giant castle at the end only have an emblem and nothing else, but on the other hand, putting lives there would be a bit unfair to Sonic, so I suppose it's fair. Knuckles' path here is difficult (it was hard for me to wrap around how the spike balls are swinging at the end of the path, I was legitimately confused), but fair. I don't love it, but I don't hate it either. (7.5/10)

CEZ2: This level is MASSIVE. It's actually quite fitting, and so much better compared to old CE2. Little secrets everywhere, a nice emblem/reward path for Knuckles, a secret library room that I was amazed with when I found it on my own, rings and lives in unexpected places...even right down to the massive score you can get from an Armageddon Shield here, exploring this level is just beautiful. It's a bit easy to get lost in here, but I feel like that's more of a good thing than a bad one. (9/10)

CEZ3: This boss is somewhat interesting, but is kind of a bore for the first 5 hits. I was made aware that Eggman raising a specific hand did a specific thing, but...who cares? He always did 1 movement for hit one, and exactly 3 movements for hits 2-5, and so watching Eggman felt like a moot point as there's no incentive to not get hit other than max guard bonus. The second phase opens up some interesting multi-hit opportunities, but overall this boss is just forgettable. (6/10)

ACZ1: I definitely wonder how this level will change in 2.2, I look forward to it. That being said, the current Arid Canyon is quite fun. A bit dangerous at times for the first-timer, but difficulty certainly should be picking up by now anyways. The addition of the lower route at the end of the level is a plus to me, it doesn't make the last part so all-or-nothing. I look forward to exploring this level further. (8/10)

RVZ1: I absolutely love the secret area in this level. I did not know there was an Elemental Shield right near the end of the level for quite a while, but when I found this area, I was amazed. Huge rewards, and I have to wonder if RV2 will mimic the atmosphere of that area (outside as opposed to inside) somehow. This level is kinda brutal to go fast in (not necessarily a bad thing, the level is still fun), but for the average player, caution is the name of the game. I sorta feel that the ring/score emblem requirements are very much on the lax side, maybe too much so. Score I could understand since the secret area was only properly implemented in 2.1.8 as far as I am aware, but only 100 rings in a 400+ ring level? I dunno, but compared to most other levels, this really seems lax. That's just nitpicking, though. (8.5/10)

ERZ1: Can you please put the first rings in the level in two rows at the very least (and in general maybe put more than 9 rings before the lazer section on the left path)? It is way too easy for someone (read: me) to steal all the rings in co-op and make everyone else suffer at the lazer part ringless because no one dares go right in co-op. Despite that, though, the level is super fun. I have loved Egg Rock Zone from the beginning, even when it kicked my ass. Egg Rock just has a certain charm to it, and I will never get tired of that level. Not entirely sure why the last room on the left path was made significantly easier; the difficulty of it seemed fair as it was. I very much like Knuckles' path here as well, it's sufficiently challenging. It might be the best Knuckles path of the game. (9/10)

ERZ2: Hands down, the act of the game, made even better without the slide section. I have a lot of fun playing this act, and even the left path is fun to go through, despite its length. Hit that Tunes 200! (9.9/10)

ERZ3: I hated this boss at first. I also thought the race was not very lenient (I still think it isn't very lenient). Now that I understand both, this level is one of my favorites. Just the thought that went into making very doable paths for all characters is quite impressive here. (8.5/10)

ERZC: This boss is amusing as a final boss. The constant thought of Eggman just laughing at you instead of going into the lava pillar is both terrifying and amusing at the same time. This boss is fairly easy to get the hang of, and that's fine, the real difficulty lies within not knowing what to expect next. (8.5/10)

Special Stages:

Floral Field: A very short, nice, beginning level. Could be on the too easy side, but I understand that the difference between getting the emerald and getting the A are vastly different, so it's probably just fine. (8/10)

Toxic Plateau: This second stage is quite fun; the scenery is nice too. (8/10)

Flooded Cove: I was perplexed as to why an emerald token exists in this level for the longest time...then I started doing All Emerald speedruns, and I had the "oh, that's why" moment. Maybe it wasn't all for that purpose, but it sure seems like it! (8/10)

Cavern Fortress: The last part of the level is kinda meh, it often ruins the momentum of the level...that said, I like the rest of it. (7.5/10)

Dusty Wasteland: Forever my only rainbow A. That said, this level still doesn't ramp up the difficulty very much, and I feel like I should expect more out of SS5. (7/10)

Magma Caves: The first challenging level, and it's still super fun. Never had any real problems with this stage, and the obstacles seem fair. (8.5/10)

Egg Satellite: I may never get to double loop this level, but this level is just so much fun, with all the tension, the stuff in the way, the sudden 120 sphere requirement...it's just beautiful. (9.5/10)

Black Hole: This is a very challenging level to get an A in, and it was certainly worth the effort. (9.5/10)

Spring Hill: The secrets hidden around the stage were definitely a fine treasure hunt, some very clever places to hide score monitors. (9/10)
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Old 12-23-2015   #55
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I'll group by zone.

Greenflower
The only real problem I have with any of the acts is the enemy variety; it's a problem most of the zones have, but it's really amplified here. Acts 1 and 2 don't do a good enough job of explaining the common enemy tropes that successive zones will throw at the player. Add to that, the crawlas are aesthetically bland as shit and don't work off of the zone's theming. The bigger problem is the boss, whose laser will not be dodged by new players, and his constant backpedaling makes him more troublesome than he should be.

A couple enemies that might be good fits for the first zone:
- An enemy with flight or jump capability, which only chases the player once approached (could be a frog or spring enemy or something)
- An enemy that stays in place and fires a very telegraphed, easy to dodge projectile (a flower enemy might be good)
- Make the crawla look like some kind of bug, I dunno.

The boss needs to be significantly toned down; give him the old missile and just reserve the laser for a later boss. Additionally, make him propel backward after every three hits, rather than after every hit.

ALSO: I think GFZ2 is visually lacking, but it's mainly because the starting area has very high rock walls and very little green or blue to break it up. If you just add like more waterfalls or some vines, it should be enough to make the scene visually interesting.

Techno Hill
Honestly pretty solid. Only thing I have a problem with is that I think the slime should have less sensitivity in regards to being able stand after landing on it.

Deep Sea
The rock maze is shit. Level's apparently getting overhauled, so I dunno what else to say. Boss needs to have a shallower floor, though; current design is overkill.

Castle Eggman
Needs to feel more Sonic 2-ish and less... Mario 64. What I mean is to supplement the death pits with alternate, harder routes. Current level layout sort of just enforces trial and error.

Also, why does the boss take so fucking long. Screw convention, just give him three hits and then three more for pinch.

Arid Canyon Zone
Pretty good.

Red Volcano Zone
Actually one of my favorites, though sometimes it's a little too reliant on the same crumbling rock gimmick. Also could use one more enemy.

Egg Rock Zone
Needs to ease players into the zone. The very first rooms of Act 1 just expect success or else you die. Put spikes on the bottom there, keep everything else the same difficulty.
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Old 12-23-2015   #56
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Also, why does the boss take so fucking long. Screw convention, just give him three hits and then three more for pinch.
I agree that it should be possible to beat Eggscalibur faster, but changing the number of hits it takes to defeat him is kind of a lazy way to do it. Instead, it should be possible to hit him more than once, maybe three times if you're really good, every time he raises his cage. That way, you can still defeat him quickly, but just like most of the game's other bosses, doing so requires a decent amount of skill and a willingness to take more risks (in this case, getting crushed by the lowering cage if you take slightly too long).
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Old 12-23-2015   #57
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Oh, hello! I never noticed this was here either... Well I might as well put my two cents in.

GFZ1: Hoo boy... It's a first level, not a very memorable or good one (Unless you're like me and have played it every other day while waiting for new content to come out of releases). Even with the updates to it that 2.1 brought, the stage still has tight corridors and is very easy to bump into walls and lose all your speed in the middle. The visuals are still bright and colorful as you'd expect from a first level, and the music eases you into the game... It certainly could use some improvements, 6/10.

GFZ2: Now this is how you do a first level! While it still has its flaws, it still keeps you at a decent speed and has good flow for most of the act. There's not many options for Sonic in the first 10 seconds besides a singular path, but it keeps it interesting with enemies and puddles on the ground for you to dodge. Tails and Knuckles have some goodies that they can aquire at the top of the level (Sonic too, if you know how to get up there), but there's not much else up there which is kinda sad, some enemies and stuff would be nice. The second half of the level is pretty good, with secrets for all three characters and multiple pathways. It's big enough that you get to explore various nooks and crannies, but also linear enough that the player doesn't feel lost while traversing it. 8/10 Too much water. -IGN

GFZ3: It's a boss... I'm not sure I can say more than that. It's fairly easy to beat once you figure out you can just go all out on it using thoks or even just jumping at it. The laser is a pretty cool showcase of what is possible in 2.1 now, and it makes sure the player knows how to control the character they're playing as, but other than that it's pretty bland. 6/10

THZ1: 2.1 has been very kind to Techno Hill act 1, I enjoyed playing through it again and not worrying the first five seconds if I was going to miss my jump and accidentally end up in a pit of acid that would kill me in 3 seconds if I didn't find a spring in time. The level flows really nicely and multiple there's multiple pathways for different characters, most notably the new Knuckles path. 7/10 - it's a solid level.

THZ2: Alright, now that the newness has worn off, let's see how this reimagined level stands among everything else.
First off, the visual design of everything in this level is beautiful, and really showcases just how cool the new features of 2.1 are. You figure out how the Jello works as soon as you enter it. The level flows nicely, keeping you at a good speed throughout the level while still maintaining a good level of difficulty for a fourth level. I can't find any complaints that wouldn't come off as minor petty things, so 10/10

THZ3: Again, it's a boss, and it hasn't changed much since 2.0, I feel like a new boss should possibly be designed around the new goop mechanics or something, I'm not entirely sure how it would work but anything would be nice. 6/10

I'm out of steam for writing so I'll probably either post a follow up for this post or edit this one.
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Old 12-23-2015   #58
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To be honest you guys did an amazing job with most of the levels. It's hard to believe that this is even a fangame TBH. :P
(Game overall is better then anything sonic team has produced imo)

Anyways... The only levels that bug me are GFZ, DSZ, CEZ, and ERZ. Since DCZ is getting a rework and all I'll just skip it.

Be warned. I suck at explaining my reasoning. rip.

GreenFlower Zone
Act 1
This REALLY shows date. I know you guys wanted some sort of tutorial level or whatever but COME ON! It's extremely short and the texture usage is pretty awful.

Act 2
Same issues as act 1 aside from being short. The texture issue really shows here. Though level design is a little better then act 1.
Spoiler:
to be honest I think it would be cool if you guys would just combine act 1/2. Make new textures for it, make it look nicer or something, and make that the new act 1. Then make a new act 2 or something.


Act 3
I mean... this boss is extremely simple. Then again. Most bosses in srb2 are extremely simple. Eggrock Core is so boring compared to the metal sonic fight. lol.

Castle Eggman Zone
Act 2
Act 1 is fine really. I just have issues with act 2 as it feels super incomplete. For example in act 2 with the cannon yard or whatever. It's so freaking bland. Also that last part where you swing up to that tower is... very bland.

Eggrock Zone
My main issue with these is the boss battles. Metal Sonic feels so stiff and long. All I do most of the time during the fight is stand still and avoid metal's attacks. Making Metal invincible and all and forcing you to wait for him to be vulnerable is really annoying. It would be cool if Metal just flashed out attacks at you constantly and you have to keep moving and time yourself just right to reach in and strike at metal. Kinda like Mystic Realm's final boss.

Brak Eggman is so boring. The "waiting to attack" thing is even worse then metal. The boss barely does anything. It just shoots flames and bombs and on the occasion fires a high knockback shot... pretty boring for the "Final Boss"
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Old 12-24-2015   #59
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Oh a bump! let me think...

If this seems overly negative and persnickety don't worry, I actually really like all of the levels. but here are the points that come to mind as annoying, bad, or un-fun.

GFZ 1: one thing that bugs me about this stage is that when you finish it in under 30 seconds, you have to wait another 30 seconds while the 1000000000 point bonus trickles in. Not really a problem for new players but a bit of a akward pause. also I think it would be a clever trick if the emblems were arranged in such a way that all characters could reach them with some clever tricks. It is incredibly short and feels like a tutorial stage without tutorial messages.

GFZ 2: on the subject of blandness, the upper path over the waterfall with the 4 platforms and bunch of monitors near the end of the level? its bland. I suggest more trees, as there is only what, 2 in the level, at the very end.

GFZ3: I like this boss,

THZ1: need more spring turtles in places spring turtles will let you do awesome jumps. maybe I am just bad, but I haven't noticed too many places that spring turtles allow for fun jumps.

THZ2: And then you make the spring turtle ladder, I hate this thing so much, namely because you don't get anything worthwhile out of it.

THZ3: Its a little outdated, It would be cool if something more was done with the "I am on a train" gimmick like having to keep up with robotnik while he throws slowing goo at you. also if you miss the hit right before the pinch phase the speed he is moving at makes him harder than the entire rest of the fight.

CEZ1: Knuckles path, Nuff said. also maybe raise the roof in the last section before the castle, its easy to hit the invisible ceiling and kinda jarring.

CEZ2: fine except the water climbing section is a bit sucky. its really tedious to get stuck there.

CEZ3: I like this boss,

ACZ: Its been a fan favorite for forever, My only complaint is the section with the giant wooden fence. I always get turned around there for some reason. maybe make each side of the fence a little more distinguished with some unique decorative boulder formations.

RVZ: fast and hectic. fine as is.

ERZ 1,2, & 3: Nothing wrong that I noticed. other than the fan section in ERZ 2 towards the beginning being a bit too precise for my liking.
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Old 12-24-2015   #60
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GFZ 1: one thing that bugs me about this stage is that when you finish it in under 30 seconds, you have to wait another 30 seconds while the 1000000000 point bonus trickles in.
Press Spin to complete the score tally instantly.
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