Suggestions

NightWind

Ringslinger and SRB2 Battle player
A toggle to turn Super music off. SRB2's music is great and their choices greatly fits the levels but Super Sonic's music just goes in and gets kinda repetitive depending on which gametype(mostly will be custom gametypes) you are playing it
 
Few things on my mind so I figured I'd share them here.

Firstly I kind of wish Marathon Mode skipped the results screen and went straight to the next zones, maybe I'm just impatient but I think the removal of intermissions would make it really feel like a marathon. On another note, why is it locked when the game is marked as modified? I don't really see a reason for it.

Outside of Simple Mode I feel like Amy's hammer should attack where the camera's facing, it allows her to aim at enemies better without having to double back around. The way it works now feels inconsistent with how other character abilities aim where the camera is facing like Fang's gun or Sonic and Knuckles air abilities.

Of course if I switch to Strafe Mode I get exactly what I described here which is weird cause I assume Strafe Mode is generally thought to be purely cosmetic and does not change any gameplay elements which makes me wonder if this is a oversight or a feature? In fact looking at it just now the game even says its "identical to standard" which doesn't seem to be the case as I explained.
 

Shaddy the guy

Professional ass-merchant
On another note, why is it locked when the game is marked as modified? I don't really see a reason for it.
Maybe it's just me, but I think we've progressed past the need for the game to change anything when it's modified. If you can download mods, you can download custom or complete savedata, and I feel like at this point halting unlocks and such when you have a mod loaded, especially one that doesn't alter gameplay, is just kind of needless.
 

Lamibe

Member
It's to not mess with vanilla gamedata I think.
Also it's impossible to know if a script is game changing so it always mark it as modified and everything else aesthetic only don't mark the game as modified.

-------------------------------------------
A suggestion: Expose ping to lua and perhaps fps
 
Last edited:

Chezi

Chili Dogs
Maybe it's just me, but I think we've progressed past the need for the game to change anything when it's modified. If you can download mods, you can download custom or complete savedata, and I feel like at this point halting unlocks and such when you have a mod loaded, especially one that doesn't alter gameplay, is just kind of needless.
It’s to prevent players from using an overpowered character, like SMS, to unlock every single emblem in the game
 

time gear

Eternity in an hour
So I decided to do another playthrough of Sonic 3, went ahead and installed the latest update to Sonic 3 A.I.R. and noticed the option to have infinite lives. Usually, I would leave an option like this toggled off. After all, I've made my case regarding why I don't view lives as at all outdated in the past in other topics here. They function as a reward for going out of your way to search for rings or 1-up monitors or simply getting high enough score or etc. and as such provide incentive to do those things, meanwhile applying pressure on the player to do well. Without them, rings (or rather holding onto more than one at a time) and score lose their value and the sense of challenge transforms into a sense of inevitability.

That got me thinking about how to design around this problem however. If lives have inherent value tied to other gameplay elements, then removing lives will require a redistribution of that value somehow to remain well designed and balanced. I took note of the fact that once the player has all the emeralds, they unlock the ability to transform. This requires 50+ rings, which are then consumed 1 per second. This gives rings circumstantial value. What if collecting rings served more purpose than just being fuel for super forms however? What if score also provided incentive? As such, here are the ideas I came up with to make the removal of the lives system retain value with SRB2 in mind (apologies if anyone else has already thought up some of these. I'm not stealing ideas intentionally and don't care about receiving credit):

  • Respawn assists: Inspired by Colors Ultimate, these take the place of the lives counter. As long as you have these in stock, death will respawn you in a safe spot nearby (or the last safe spot on solid ground you were standing if you fell into a bottomless pit) instead of sending you to the last checkpoint. When you run out, death always returns you to the most recently activated checkpoint. 1-up monitors are replaced by Assist monitors. Respawn assists cannot be spent during boss acts.
  • Score revamp: You have two types of score. The first type is "Current Score", which is the score you have accumulated within the current act. The second type is "Total Score", which your current score goes into at the end of the act. "Total Score" is permanent. "Current Score" is recorded when you touch a new checkpoint and reverted back when you return to that checkpoint after death.
  • Checkpoint shops; you can spend collected rings and current score at checkpoints in exchange for shields or temporary invincibility. Regular shields are cheaper, elemental shields and etc. are more expensive. Even more expensive are respawn assists, also available in the shop. Also, you can spend some of your current score or rings to warp to the next untouched checkpoint, skipping everything in-between. The act timer freezes while shopping in single player.
  • Finishing a level and receiving high enough total score rewards you with a shield to start out the next act with, or lets you keep the one you already have.
  • If you are out of assists and are dying between the same two checkpoints a lot, the current score price to skip goes down making it more affordable.
  • Collecting 100 rings rewards a respawn assist.
  • Respawn assists can be toggled on and off in the options menu. When off, Assist monitors are replaced with Invincibility monitors and you can't buy them (assist monitors) in checkpoint shops.

The hope is that this system would be a fair and balanced way of replacing the lives system. It includes additional handholds for newer players who want/need them while hopefully not punishing experienced players too much who are looking for incentive to explore or who want a challenge.
 
Last edited:

Chezi

Chili Dogs
Yeah, but...who cares?

Like, why not let them do that?

If you can download SMS, you can download a 100% save.
So just download a 100% save file. Locking things that require save data when you have an add on loaded prevents your unmodded data from being changed. A lot of people appreciate that
 

time gear

Eternity in an hour
I honestly couldn't care less if someone is completing the game legitimately or not, but cheesing it via mods is still cheating regardless. There's a difference between someone going out of their way to enable that kind of thing and it being implemented into the core design of the game. If someone wants to download a mod that enables a save file that allows cheating, all the power to them. However, that should stay the hell out of the vanilla experience.
 

Chezi

Chili Dogs
Can't that argument go both ways? "If you don't want your data changed, then just don't use mods?"
There’s a difference between wanting to change your save data and wanting it to stay unchanged. There’s a reason why the Custom Savedata mod and level packs like 2006 act as if it’s a whole new game
 

Shaddy the guy

Professional ass-merchant
I honestly couldn't care less if someone is completing the game legitimately or not, but cheesing it via mods is still cheating regardless. There's a difference between someone going out of their way to enable that kind of thing and it being implemented into the core design of the game. If someone wants to download a mod that enables a save file that allows cheating, all the power to them. However, that should stay the hell out of the vanilla experience.
Removing a restriction is not the same as "implementing cheating into the core design of the game".
There’s a difference between wanting to change your save data and wanting it to stay unchanged. There’s a reason why the Custom Savedata mod and level packs like 2006 act as if it’s a whole new game
Okay, so just make mods do that instead then? I'm still not seeing an argument for keeping the no-saving thing here.
 

Chezi

Chili Dogs
Removing a restriction is not the same as "implementing cheating into the core design of the game".

Okay, so just make mods do that instead then? I'm still not seeing an argument for keeping the no-saving thing here.
That means you aren’t reading into too far into the whole situation. There are people that want to keep their vanilla saves intact, me included. If you want to play the game modded, there’s a fail safe in the game that prevents your vanilla game from changing because you loaded up that OP Sonic mod. If you want to cheat the game, you can mod that in as well. It’s safer for everyone involved to not have vanilla saves active while the game is modded
 

time gear

Eternity in an hour
Removing a restriction is not the same as "implementing cheating into the core design of the game".
Yes it is. Progression in SRB2 is designed as such that it saves your progress when you collect a thing or reach a certain point or are given a particular reward unlockable for doing a thing or etc. When you attempt to do this illegitimately, it refuses to save and disables unlockables. That is built into it's core design. To remove these restrictions would be to change the core design of the game.

What Chezi is getting at is that under the current system, if you don't want to cheese the game for progress/unlockables you are still safe to play around with mods without having to unlock everything naturally first. It simply disables progress so that you can dick around with whatever mods you please without worrying about tainting your save file. To remove this would mean that there would be inherent risk of unlocking something illegitimately every time you loaded up a big enough mod like a character or etc. unless you had already done everything. That safety net would be gone.

If you want to go out of your way to remove that safety net yourself, there are tools made available for you to do that and nobody is telling you that you can't. However, that is an entirely different thing from it being forced on everyone by the core design of the game being altered. Yes, it's a restriction. However, it's also a safety net, and not all restrictions are bad. What you are proposing would completely break the progression system for everyone who wants to do things legitimately but also wants to play around with mods and doesn't want to have to wait until they've done everything they care about first to be able to safely do so. Or to put it another way, you would be replacing the restriction on progression with a restriction on when you can safely use mods.
 
Last edited:

Who is viewing this thread (Total: 2, Members: 0, Guests: 2)

Top