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Old 01-03-2014   #1
Bluecore
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Default Teams Suck

Quote:
Do not ask for "teams" to make your mod for you.
On the subject of teams, I see a lot of people who say, "I'm going to get some friends together and we're going to make a Srb2 Mod"

This Is a VERY bad idea.

There are multiple reason, I mean of course your're going to get mad at them.
Sometime, your going to want to work, they're going to want to screw around
That's obvious

But there are other reasons:

First If your just starting, the learning curve for a programmer is about 10x as more then an Artist or Musician. *Not Saying their job is any easier*

But the learning curve itself. It takes a programmer much more time, where they can get to the level that they can work on a game then It does for an Artist or Musician.
And this can cause a lot of problems if you're just starting in a team.

Also in teams, you don't get together to make the game, all the time.
That's not how it works

During the Week, you sit at home, alone, not in contact with each other. But you still have to get your stuff done.
Then on the weekends you can integrate your stuff.

It's still a very anti-social processes.

You need to be able to sit alone, in a dark room and think about this stuff.
You can't just create the entire thing together, that doesn't work.

You all need to be Self Motivated.

And finding a team that believes in the same thing you do and shares your vision is really hard.

But for Those who on insist to form teams, Some recommendation I have:

First of all, make sure you personally know your team.
Make sure they're not going to get their feeling hurt when you complain at them.
You need to be able to lay it out for them, and if their feelings are hurt, They probably don't need to be on the team.
Because when people are putting this much effort into a idea, that's something that can get in the way

A very import thing I recommend is, your team members need to be knowledgeable all around. Lets say, your Artist wants Huge PNG Sprites for Bosses. And they don't know why Srb2 can handle that, so you can't really explain to them.
That causes a lot of trouble

Good Team Members, Focus on One area, but are Knowledgeable on others.


And that's my recommendation to You.

So go out, and make your Srb2 PropHunt, but don't forget me.
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Old 01-03-2014   #2
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I don't know that much about WADs and stuff, but are there any WADs or mods of SRB2 that were made with team effort?
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Old 01-03-2014   #3
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Default Re: Teams Suck

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluecore View Post
On the subject of teams, I see a lot of people who say, "I'm going to get some friends together and we're going to make a Srb2 Mod"

This Is a VERY bad idea.

There are multiple reason, I mean of course your're going to get mad at them.
Sometime, your going to want to work, they're going to want to screw around
That's obvious

But there are other reasons:

First If your just starting, the learning curve for a programmer is about 10x as more then an Artist or Musician. *Not Saying their job is any easier*

But the learning curve itself. It takes a programmer much more time, where they can get to the level that they can work on a game then It does for an Artist or Musician.
And this can cause a lot of problems if you're just starting in a team.

Also in teams, you don't get together to make the game, all the time.
That's not how it works

During the Week, you sit at home, alone, not in contact with each other. But you still have to get your stuff done.
Then on the weekends you can integrate your stuff.

It's still a very anti-social processes.

You need to be able to sit alone, in a dark room and think about this stuff.
You can't just create the entire thing together, that doesn't work.

You all need to be Self Motivated.

And finding a team that believes in the same thing you do and shares your vision is really hard.

But for Those who on insist to form teams, Some recommendation I have:

First of all, make sure you personally know your team.
Make sure they're not going to get their feeling hurt when you complain at them.
You need to be able to lay it out for them, and if their feelings are hurt, They probably don't need to be on the team.
Because when people are putting this much effort into a idea, that's something that can get in the way

A very import thing I recommend is, your team members need to be knowledgeable all around. Lets say, your Artist wants Huge PNG Sprites for Bosses. And they don't know why Srb2 can handle that, so you can't really explain to them.
That causes a lot of trouble

Good Team Members, Focus on One area, but are Knowledgeable on others.


And that's my recommendation to You.

So go out, and make your Srb2 PropHunt, but don't forget me.
No, that's stupid. Wasn't SRB2 made by a team? Most really good mods are made by a team. Most projects and game developers work together. In fact, a lot of my projects are done with others. You have more of a chance to fail working alone than working in a team.

Last edited by RainbowDash; 01-03-2014 at 03:32 PM.
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Old 01-03-2014   #4
VelocitOni
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Moral of the topic: Fuck working with people and being productive in all categories of a game.

Work alone.
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Old 01-03-2014   #5
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I see you have made alot of points, but lots of those points are made from your conditions and may not apply to others. Support each point with evidence to get your point across, otherwise they are just words that don't mean much. Give at least some examples for each point so we know what you mean, because I for one am not a person who only meets up with mt friends on the weekends (that rhymes), and sit in a dark room thinking about the work in progress.
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Old 01-03-2014   #6
Inazuma
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Baseless assumptions and "What-ifs" are standard violations in persuasive arguments. Using these kinds of methods in arguments will only portray to the audience that the persuader is just an idiot and probably had little to no knowledge or experience in the field that said speaker is discussing about.

Also I think this topic was posted on the wrong board.
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Old 01-03-2014   #7
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Teams do work as long as you have good chemistry you can get twice the amount of work done when working in a group.
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Last edited by That2rb2DUDE; 01-03-2014 at 06:40 PM.
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Old 01-03-2014   #8
Larztard
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Quote:
Originally Posted by That2rb2DUDE View Post
Teams do work along as you have good chemistry you can get twice the amount of work done when working in a group.
I have been working on this one wad with my best friend and my brother for almost three years now. It's actually more fun sitting all around creating levels. Also, it doesn't hurt to get outside help once in a while.

---------- Post added at 01:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:11 PM ----------

Quote:
Do not ask for "teams" to make your mod for you.
Also I think this rule means don't ask a team to make you a wad while you sit on your ass and do nothing while you dictate them.
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Last edited by Larztard; 01-03-2014 at 06:17 PM.
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Old 01-03-2014   #9
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We'll show this creep the real super power of-
Sorry.

But yeah teamwork is a really good thing. If you actually get somewhere you get closer to people. If you work in a team you're more able to get progress done, and get it done QUICKER. Being a lone wolf isn't a good thing.

A lot of the famous SRB2 wads are done with some element of teamwork. o3o
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Old 01-03-2014   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RainbowDash View Post
You have more of a chance to fail working alone than working in a team.
Does this apply to Wads too?
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Old 01-03-2014   #11
akb778
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This thread could've fit right at home in the old Coliseum (or whatever it was called... the part of the forum that was for debates that no longer exists).

Anyways, I always thought that this rule was around because of the possibility of the one person who assembles a team to work on a mod and then promptly does nothing outside of being the "leader". In other words, getting people to make a wad for you instead of working with those people as an actual team.
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Old 01-03-2014   #12
Bluecore
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akb778 View Post
This thread could've fit the part of the forum that was for debates.
I wasn't planing it to be a debate, but because people Still insist on making teams, hopefully they will follow the recommendations.
As seeing your own creation burn up in flames, is a real motivation killer, & if you have all these people. Waiting for your Wad/Game. Because you Hype your stuff Way before you had anything really presentable.
Knowing that you have to do All of your work again, is really hard...

But don't Quit, because you Never Lose, in till you Quit.
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Old 01-04-2014   #13
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I've done huge team projects. Most of them are popular on the master server as of today. I've also done many projects by my self as well. And even made team projects that was entered in the OLDC. (Sadly they we're never credited by me for some odd reason) But the fact is, team projects are not bad. Unless you got a terrible member working with you. But simply just get rid of that member and get a new one. Pretty easy if I do say so my self.
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Old 01-04-2014   #14
Bluecore
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EternallyAries View Post
simply get rid of that member and get a new one. Pretty easy if I do say so my self.
Not as easy as it sounds.
You want to build bridges not burn them, for one could hold a Good Future.
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Old 01-04-2014   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluecore View Post
Not as easy as it sounds.
You want to build bridges not burn them, for one could hold a Good Future.
And to build a bridge, you need a working team. And holding lazy members is a bad idea. I understand getting rid of them can be wrong, but it is rather needed. Of course finding said person to help work with a project can also be tough. But you can still work with the team members you have at the moment. And work from that. Of course, at times you might be stuck and work on your own. But hey, it happens. Not everyone gonna be on the same concept as another person thinking. Honestly it is quite possible to work with a huge team. If the STJR team can do it. So can others.
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Old 01-04-2014   #16
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PLUS, you can use Skype to share ideas over the week. It does not have to be "anti-social."
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Old 01-06-2014   #17
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Just going to say, most great games were not made by 1 person.
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Old 01-06-2014   #18
Monster Iestyn
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Locking this because it's obvious by now (nearly) everyone disagrees with the original post, and this thread doesn't look like it's going to get any further than saying the same thing either, which pretty much everyone has also done.
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