Playable Sonic by r543

[r543]

The feet look odd, since they're drawn at foot level rather than at camera level (they should look more like this, only for the front and diagonal front frames though). The spikes also could use some smoothing or something to make them look less jagged, on the side frame. Aside from that, this is by far the best Modern Sonic I've ever seen in SRB2, and I wish you the best of luck!

...I have to ask, though, did you use a 3D model as a guide? This looks incredible.

Yes, I'm using Fragmotion to create sprites of the 3d model, they are rendnered from a distance so they already have the right size:

after that, I color the sprite in different colors(it's different colors so that I don't miss a pixel of the original color) and then add the shading and everything.

 

[MotorRoach]

I'm sorry but I don't like the extra pixels

Don't be silly, it has nothing to do with extra pixels or extra colors. It has to do with how you shade it, and would help giving depth to your sprite's contrast. You can make anti aliasing on the sprite just with the colors already in it without having to add more.

 

[SteelT]

I see so many problems with the sprites. It looks too small, lacks proper shading and it looks too fuzzy. But that's all due to the fact you just resized a 3D Model, I recommend to just scrap this all together and work on better sprites.

 

[MotdSpork]

I see so many problems with the sprites. It looks too small, lacks proper shading and it looks too fuzzy. But that's all due to the fact you just resized a 3D Model, I recommend to just scrap this all together and work on better sprites.

He didn't necessarily resize a 3d model. He is Spriting based on the size and proportions of the model to give it a modern sonic look.

 

[r543]

I see so many problems with the sprites. It looks too small, lacks proper shading and it looks too fuzzy. But that's all due to the fact you just resized a 3D Model, I recommend to just scrap this all together and work on better sprites.

I compared the sprite to the srb2 sonic and it's bigger, I don't think that making it any bigger would be useful without a custom camera because the sprite starts to get in the way.

I'm taking the outline and some parts of the model as a base(so that it's easier to do the 45 degree sprites) and this isn't a simple model copypaste.

I'm using the outlines but all of the shading is custom(as you can see I recolor the model to different colors so that it doesn't have any of the original colors on it and then do the custom shading. Almost nothing(exept for a little change of colors so that the first 2 shades aren't as bright and a removed color which was only used for some small anti aliasing parts) was changed for the main idle sprite. I don't think that another palette change would be a good idea and I can't make the sprite much brighter on the blue part because the first 4 ? shades of blue look bad with the darker ones, which limits the palette a bit.

I'm surprised how everyone starts to hate it because this wad is based on 3d sprites. The only thing that it takes from them is the shape, and even that was edited for most of the sprites to look better.

This isn't your bad "oh I screenshot sonic from a 3d game and make a wad out of it" wad, this was done with hand made animations and a tool for creating sprites out of it, not a random screenshot or something that got resized.

 

[Terra]

I don't think that making it any bigger would be useful without a custom camera because the sprite starts to get in the way.

There's something called high res. Maybe you might want to try that if the sprite starts to "get in the way"?

 

[r543]

There's something called high res. Maybe you might want to try that if the sprite starts to "get in the way"?

Why would I use highres on a sprite ? It wouldn't fit well with the other sprites, there is a bug with highres and you can't highres everything.

 

[Zwip-Zwap Zapony]

Why would I use highres on a sprite ? It wouldn't fit well with the other sprites, there is a bug with highres and you can't highres everything.

As far as I'm aware, high-resolution sprites work perfectly fine, just only for players, and it does scale life icons (on monitors) and end sign poses too (which is annoying to deal with at a highresscale of 1.4), plus it not only looks really bad together with other sprites, but also increases filesize a lot (unless one scales small sprites up instead of big ones down).

 

[MotorRoach]

Or just... not do it. Making a high-res WAD would just double the amount of work, so just stick with the resolution you have now. If it needs to look smoother, just shade it differently and with a decent combination of colors, because it won't magically look better if you just make it high-res.

The criticism for this Sonic at the moment is barely constructive at all, specially what Steel Titanium said. It's exactly like saying "It sucks, start all over". How about explaining what's wrong with it? What can be fixed? Or how it can not "suck"? The sprites are based on a model, so regarding his size, design and shape, he seems accurate already. It only needs to be mostly improved shading-wise.

In short, no, don't go for high-res... just don't. If you want to make the sprite look better, then your sprite needs some serious anti-aliasing. As I've said, anti aliasing has nothing to do with extra colors or anything, it can be made out of the colors already in the sprite, and it's a common method done by many spriters, even with just a small amount of colors. Just stick with what you have and try to make it better from there.

 

[frozenLake]

I feel most of the sprite is fine, except the hand in back on the front diagonal sprites isn't really shaded properly. I can't tell where the thumb is, and the pointer finger looks like some sort of mutant blob. As you can see by the model, the palm of the hand is out of the light, creating a shadow. If you could recreate this effect, the said issue may be fixed.

 

[Zwip-Zwap Zapony]

Or just... not do it. - In short, no, don't go for high-res... just don't. -

- plus it not only looks really bad together with other sprites, but also increases filesize a lot -

I really dislike high-resolution sprites when it comes to Sonic Robo Blast 2, too(?). It just... doesn't look Sonic Robo Blast 2-y to me at all. If people want high resolution, they can just slap the MD2 on, which also smooths most animations out. If I'm correct, the sprites are even made out of a custom MD2, after all. The only good reason I see to use high-res player sprites at all is to scale accidentally-too-small sprites up (and even then it should still be avoided if at all possible), never on-purpose-too-big sprites down.

I really like how this Sonic Wad is coming along, though. It looks really nice in my opinion. Edit: Well, except the blue looks pretty dark. That's the only thing I don't love about this Wad so far.

 

[r543]

Or just... not do it. Making a high-res WAD would just double the amount of work, so just stick with the resolution you have now. If it needs to look smoother, just shade it differently and with a decent combination of colors, because it won't magically look better if you just make it high-res.

The criticism for this Sonic at the moment is barely constructive at all, specially what Steel Titanium said. It's exactly like saying "It sucks, start all over". How about explaining what's wrong with it? What can be fixed? Or how it can not "suck"? The sprites are based on a model, so regarding his size, design and shape, he seems accurate already. It only needs to be mostly improved shading-wise.

In short, no, don't go for high-res... just don't. If you want to make the sprite look better, then your sprite needs some serious anti-aliasing. As I've said, anti aliasing has nothing to do with extra colors or anything, it can be made out of the colors already in the sprite, and it's a common method done by many spriters, even with just a small amount of colors. Just stick with what you have and try to make it better from there.

Thanks for the feedback.
Steel's Feedback isn't too bad, I've seen worse on the irc chat. It might be because people remember the bad wads that used 3d models, this is different, it uses the model as a base for the shape but all of the shading and some redone parts are custom, it was one idea that I had to create easier 45 degree frames, before this wad got a big thing, going to try something different or even completely custom sprites for the next wad.

I'm not sure on how to add extra antialiasing to the sprite without having to add more extra colors, I don't want to restart with new shading and everything again, that happened already too many times and it's slowing this wad down by a lot. I'm trying to keep the sprites styled like sprites and the other objects/other character wads, so I'm not a big fan of this antialiasing. I'm thinking about changing the palette for the sprite again, so that the different colors stay out more and don't blend into one color that well, but it might look better ingame.

As far as I'm aware, high-resolution sprites work perfectly fine, just only for players, and it does scale life icons (on monitors) and end sign poses too (which is annoying to deal with at a highresscale of 1.4), plus it not only looks really bad together with other sprites, but also increases filesize a lot (unless one scales small sprites up instead of big ones down).

The problem with high resolution is that I can't make every object high resolution and I think that the sprite style doesn't work if unleashed sonic has double the pixels than any other object on the same height.

 

[Zwip-Zwap Zapony]

The problem with high resolution is that I can't make every object high resolution and I think that the sprite style doesn't work if unleashed sonic has double the pixels than any other object on the same height.

...Please, someone, help me out of this place. That is what I meant when I said "looks really bad". It looks really bad.

 

[MotorRoach]

I'm not sure on how to add extra antialiasing to the sprite without having to add more extra colors

See? I did this using the colors that were already in the sprite and merely editing the shading a bit. Didn't have to completely remake it either. As I've said, it's not how many colors you use, it's how you use them.

Speaking of colors, while editing the sprite, I realize the contrast on this Sonic is rather poor. The brightest blue in the sprite is far too bright, and the blue shading is really low on contrast. The same could be said about the whites in it, and specially the shoes, you can barely tell there is shading in there. If you want to give your sprite more depth, you will need to change the colors in it, because it's quite of a mess right now. And I also really recommend that you use beige for outlining the skin areas, because peach is way too soft of a color for shading in here.

 

[r543]

See? I did this using the colors that were already in the sprite and merely editing the shading a bit. Didn't have to completely remake it either. As I've said, it's not how many colors you use, it's how you use them.

Speaking of colors, while editing the sprite, I realize the contrast on this Sonic is rather poor. The brightest blue in the sprite is far too bright, and the blue shading is really low on contrast. The same could be said about the whites in it, and specially the shoes, you can barely tell there is shading in there. If you want to give your sprite more depth, you will need to change the colors in it, because it's quite of a mess right now. And I also really recommend that you use beige for outlining the skin areas, because peach is way too soft of a color for shading in here.

I see what you changed, but I'm not sure if I should remove 1 shade and use that color for the antialiasing.

The color palette got changed a lot(and I'm thinking about changing it again after completing more sprites). One of the palettes had a even brighter blue for the first few shades. I'd like to make sonic a bit brighter, but I think that he already uses 232 or 233 and using any of the blue shade that's lighter than that doesn't look good with the other blue parts.

The white part used to have a darker palette, but that was almost too dark and the white parts started to look grey, started to think about changing the palette again so that it works better on the shoes.

I'll try to add some antialiasing and change the palette but I don't have time at the moment so it will probably take some time for a update.

 

[MotorRoach]

Oh my god, no, that is not what I meant, it's not about removing colors for making the anti aliasing work. You should take the sprite I made and zoom it in to see what I mean.

 

[r543]

Oh my god, no, that is not what I meant, it's not about removing colors for making the anti aliasing work. You should take the sprite I made and zoom it in to see what I mean.

I zoomed in to see it before, but you removed the second shade of blue and used that for antialiasing ?

 

[MotorRoach]

I didn't remove anything, the shade of blue is still there. It was all quick editing.

 

[r543]

I didn't remove anything, the shade of blue is still there. It was all quick editing.

What I wanted to say is that the second shade of blue isn't used for shading, but only for antialiasing and the 3rd shade of blue is now used for shading in the places where the second one was used. Sorry if it's is too confusing, going to make a image of it later when I have time.

 

[MotdSpork]

well, im hoping i get that beta of this soon. i was going to ask you on the IRC but i havent seen you on there lately. maybe life stuff im assuming.