TelosTurntable
How the turns have tel- tab-
AHA! That's where my second idea comes into play.
A S_SKIN attribute called something along the lines of LOOPANIM that decides whether or not to use looping animations.
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fickle hearts and other parts
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AHA! That's where my second idea comes into play.
A S_SKIN attribute called something along the lines of LOOPANIM that decides whether or not to use looping animations.
You are endorsing way too much extra effort just for an attribute that literally nobody would want to use for their characters. Your idea isn't good at all, and neither are loopings in general, when it comes to this game.
If I really wanted to give ideas for loops in here, I'd probably suggest something that saves everyone from having to make sprites for extra angles and just use spinning sprites instead-- I would most likely suggest to make loops ala Sonic 3D Blast, where there's something that just makes Sonic spin through the looping. It might as well be something automatic.
But even then, endorsing loops into the game is a bad idea and would most likely overcomplicate things further than it needs to be. Leave it be at slopes, and spare Red from having to do the nightmare that would be loops, because he's already having enough trouble with the slopes themselves already.
If I really wanted to give ideas for loops in here, I'd probably suggest something that saves everyone from having to make sprites for extra angles and just use spinning sprites instead-- I would most likely suggest to make loops ala Sonic 3D Blast, where there's something that just makes Sonic spin through the looping. It might as well be something automatic.
But even then, endorsing loops into the game is a bad idea and would most likely overcomplicate things further than it needs to be. Leave it be at slopes, and spare Red from having to do the nightmare that would be loops, because he's already having enough trouble with the slopes themselves already.
What stops me from just jumping in between the loop?
In the 2D games, the loop was used as an obstacle, where you had to gain enough speed to get past, but in return you were rewarded with even more speed. In a 3D space, it's completely pointless as you can just jump in between the loops slopes, which completely defeats the point.
And if you go for 3D Blast styled loops, we already can do that! Remember those Zoom Tube loops in custom levels that nobody likes? Imagine the same thing but with slopes that you still don't interact with.
In the 2D games, the loop was used as an obstacle, where you had to gain enough speed to get past, but in return you were rewarded with even more speed. In a 3D space, it's completely pointless as you can just jump in between the loops slopes, which completely defeats the point.
And if you go for 3D Blast styled loops, we already can do that! Remember those Zoom Tube loops in custom levels that nobody likes? Imagine the same thing but with slopes that you still don't interact with.
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TelosTurntable
How the turns have tel- tab-
Hm, you're right. Speaking of slopes, ceiling slopes are a thing, right?
You guys are thinking way too narrowly about this. This doesn't have to be about loop de loops, it's just ceiling slopes. When I think of 3d applications, I just think about the Angel Island half-loops that get you from one floor to the next, or Carnival Night's ceiling walking.
And no I'm not suggesting we create tons of upside down sprites for that, because that's... fucking stupid. But the physics are probably not as hard as some people are thinking. Hell, we might actually be able to get full running through a loop if we just exploit the gravity tag in some way. Even if not, all you have to do is set the player into spin state and that'd be practical enough.
And no I'm not suggesting we create tons of upside down sprites for that, because that's... fucking stupid. But the physics are probably not as hard as some people are thinking. Hell, we might actually be able to get full running through a loop if we just exploit the gravity tag in some way. Even if not, all you have to do is set the player into spin state and that'd be practical enough.
I just don't think that it'll be as simple as setting the player into their spinning state. Keep in mind that some custom characters have no spinning states (ex: Zim), and the player switching states like that sounds off to me.
I'm also skeptical of how the camera will act on ceiling slopes, as they should change your direction, and the camera could easily get stuck. EDIT: This part is a bit hard to explain (and I didn't explain it well, either); here's a scribble to hopefully demonstrate what I mean (http://i.imgur.com/act42uo.png)
I'm also skeptical of how the camera will act on ceiling slopes, as they should change your direction, and the camera could easily get stuck. EDIT: This part is a bit hard to explain (and I didn't explain it well, either); here's a scribble to hopefully demonstrate what I mean (http://i.imgur.com/act42uo.png)
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What happens if the character has no spin states, then?
But I don't think loops are needing to be a thing in SRB2 for the reasons TehRealSalt mentionned, they're just gonna be timewasters for both level designing and gameplay.
What you could probably do is make some sort of temporary reverse gravity tag that makes it so the player stands/runs upside down on ceiling slopes so long as he has X amount of momentum. The camera would be more complicated, but you could probably just let it stay in place during the slope running until the player is either on a perfectly even ceiling or has fallen off of the slope. This shouldn't mess with the controls, because when you press the forward button, the game conventionally moves the character forward in its direction, not the camera's direction.
Wall- and ceiling-running would not only look incredibly silly without a full set of running sprites for each angle (and don't say "just use spinning sprites", because that's a visibly ugly hack that goes against what anyone playing the game would expect to happen), but would also be a nightmare to get the camera to work well for. Perspective in software mode is pretty much garbage, so tilting the camera up to follow the player wouldn't work (and doing that even in OGL, with proper perspective, would just cause nausea), but just leaving the camera straight would make it impossible for the player to see where they're going once any vertical momentum is involved. This leaves cut-away views, which would then disconnect "move forward" and "move away from the camera" in non-analog mode. If you're proposing to automate the process of running through a loop to avoid that, then you might as well just fake it with a zoom tube.
TelosTurntable
How the turns have tel- tab-
Ceiling running is already a thing... It's called anti gravity :P I think you may be referring to something else?
Yes. I'm referring to the wall-running and loops that you guys are badgering me to implement.
Let me sum this up for you guys: there's no clean, satisfactory way to implement wall-running (a requirement for loops) in our engine. So loops aren't happening. Anything you could do with them in terms of platforming has a solution that works much better in the primarily-horizontal view field present in 3D games.
Let me sum this up for you guys: there's no clean, satisfactory way to implement wall-running (a requirement for loops) in our engine. So loops aren't happening. Anything you could do with them in terms of platforming has a solution that works much better in the primarily-horizontal view field present in 3D games.
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When you're in reverse gravity the ceiling becomes the floor and vice versa, from a gameplay standpoint anyway.
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slopes are looking great red
Heh, he already got that uploaded? If you look closely you might be able to see me in Lightspeed's video.
Red uploaded a exe that changes a very important value, FRACBITS, from 32768 (IIRC) to 15. This is completely unrelated to slopes, doesn't even have slope code in it, and is purposely trippy and unplayable.
You just had to ruin the mystery for yourself didn't you >:C
You just had to ruin the mystery for yourself didn't you >:C
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PrismaticAngel
Dutch word-doer
"map map56"; we didn't play through the entire game with that. That would be insane!
Monster Iestyn
Fangtastic
FRACBITS was changed from 16 to 15 ...which in turn changes FRACUNIT from 65536 to 32768. Given that FRACUNIT is a basic unit of measure for ...well, everything, obviously the game does not like the changes made here!
By the way, that's the "Courier New" font I'm using for those special constant names, just because. B)
By the way, that's the "Courier New" font I'm using for those special constant names, just because. B)
GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOAL
Edit:
Someone made a snide remark about character balance, so I gave Tails and Knuckles their own abilities to help them out. I haven't tried these in a game to see how they work balance-wise, though.
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