SuperPhanto
Bad at every videogame ever
I mean, he is the Master Emerald. Maybe he knows something about the chaos emeralds that we don't?
How did Knuckles knock the emeralds out of Sonic?
- Thread starter Noxious
- Start date
Jammin'
I fucking hate the average person on this site.
no. it was barely enough time for sonic to run out of 50 rings.
Axolex53
Unknown person
lnferno
Blazing Creator
I'll add on my own thoughts:
- First of all, for the last time, S3&K takes place MONTHS after S2, as shown in the Japanese manual for Sonic 3.
- Second of all, Knuckles has been around the energy of the Chaos Emeralds his entire life. He likely knows how to manipulate said energy by now. He also has a built-in tie to the Master Emerald (shown by the Emerald Hunt radar in SA1 and SA2). Is it all that hard to believe that Knuckles simply somehow cancelled out the Super Form whilst performing the uppercut?
- First of all, for the last time, S3&K takes place MONTHS after S2, as shown in the Japanese manual for Sonic 3.
- Second of all, Knuckles has been around the energy of the Chaos Emeralds his entire life. He likely knows how to manipulate said energy by now. He also has a built-in tie to the Master Emerald (shown by the Emerald Hunt radar in SA1 and SA2). Is it all that hard to believe that Knuckles simply somehow cancelled out the Super Form whilst performing the uppercut?
Basic Bronze Sonic
Barely active MB member, active on Discord/Twitter
I mean in that case why wouldn't he do the same thing to Mecha Sonic?
Instead Knuckles just waited patiently for Mecha Sonic's super form time to run out in S3NK.
lnferno
Blazing Creator
Because, in this case, we aren't dealing with the Chaos Emeralds: we're dealing with the Master Emerald itself. The Master Emerald controls the Chaos Emeralds, but it doesn't control itself, is my guess.
lnferno
Blazing Creator
Literally what I just tried to say: as a result, he used the fact that he could catch Sonic off guard to literally knock the Chaos Emeralds out of Sonic.
This question is super simple to answer from a Doylist (out of universe) perspective! They wanted to maintain continuity with the end of Sonic 2 (since, unlike 1, it didn't show the emeralds disappearing), and it establishes that Knuckles was a serious new threat to Sonic. It's also worth mentioning that it's cool as heck to watch, and works thematically with the exploration of using the super powers of the emeralds the rest of the title goes into.
The trouble is that while these things were quite effective for the kids of the 90's at large, there's a lot of lore poisoning going around where people demand a Watsonian (in-universe) explanation for every development, or to quantify power levels or abilities - this is the mindset Death Battles is a symptom of. While the occasional creator may go absolutely ham on those details, for a series as long-running as Sonic it's a fool's errand.
The trouble is that while these things were quite effective for the kids of the 90's at large, there's a lot of lore poisoning going around where people demand a Watsonian (in-universe) explanation for every development, or to quantify power levels or abilities - this is the mindset Death Battles is a symptom of. While the occasional creator may go absolutely ham on those details, for a series as long-running as Sonic it's a fool's errand.
Axolex53
Unknown person
That's a simple answer for all the thread, and it really makes sense, so i can agree with this fact. The only question that bothers me it's literally made it by Beans at the beginning:
But I also agree with Toaster's opinion, the Sonic Universe and the chronological events are too confused to understand
Curedleaves
Member
Hittin' the heart area
SIG7Pro
I hate my life.
Basic Bronze Sonic
Barely active MB member, active on Discord/Twitter
ooh man we got some more theories
Time to review them
First off is
Well this suggests that Knuckles knows a little more about the chaos emeralds than Sonic which it also makes canonical sense because Sonic would soon master the use of the chaos emeralds and thus no longer have said unknown weak spot, I like it.
Next let's get to
well yes Sonic could have had the emeralds in his pocket (or wherever he stores them) but whenever we see Sonic go super then the emeralds come out and circle around him and we see that in Sonic adventure 2 and in Sonic 06 that the chaos emeralds energy can be shared with multiple people (Sonic heroes does not count) so the emeralds can't really just be stored in a pocket of some sort but instead might (and bear with me here) be stored within a pocket dimension of some sort (haha... get it?) because we all know that Sonic and shadow don't agree with echother like ever so there's no way they would come up to an agreement on who holds the chaos emeralds and also in Sonic 06 Sonic, shadow, and silver all in their super forms go into separate points of time but they're still in their super forms but you may be asking why am I saying this... Well if that theory is true then maybe we could say that Knuckles used chaos control to remove the emeralds from super Sonic's possession which Knuckles could probably do because he's been around the master emerald his whole life and we've seen him go super and hyper so maybe SIG7's theory might be correct.
Oh yeah also for evidence as to why he doesn't use chaos control ever again is because he probably just did it on accident and most definitely never learns how to do chaos control throughout the entire series.
TLDR- theory #1-Knuckles might know a little more about the chaos emeralds than Sonic, theory #2- Knuckles used chaos control.
Time to review them
First off is
Weekblues said:
Well this suggests that Knuckles knows a little more about the chaos emeralds than Sonic which it also makes canonical sense because Sonic would soon master the use of the chaos emeralds and thus no longer have said unknown weak spot, I like it.
Next let's get to
SIG7 said:
well yes Sonic could have had the emeralds in his pocket (or wherever he stores them) but whenever we see Sonic go super then the emeralds come out and circle around him and we see that in Sonic adventure 2 and in Sonic 06 that the chaos emeralds energy can be shared with multiple people (Sonic heroes does not count) so the emeralds can't really just be stored in a pocket of some sort but instead might (and bear with me here) be stored within a pocket dimension of some sort (haha... get it?) because we all know that Sonic and shadow don't agree with echother like ever so there's no way they would come up to an agreement on who holds the chaos emeralds and also in Sonic 06 Sonic, shadow, and silver all in their super forms go into separate points of time but they're still in their super forms but you may be asking why am I saying this... Well if that theory is true then maybe we could say that Knuckles used chaos control to remove the emeralds from super Sonic's possession which Knuckles could probably do because he's been around the master emerald his whole life and we've seen him go super and hyper so maybe SIG7's theory might be correct.
Oh yeah also for evidence as to why he doesn't use chaos control ever again is because he probably just did it on accident and most definitely never learns how to do chaos control throughout the entire series.
TLDR- theory #1-Knuckles might know a little more about the chaos emeralds than Sonic, theory #2- Knuckles used chaos control.
Basic Bronze Sonic
Barely active MB member, active on Discord/Twitter
WARNING-really long post, find some spare time to read through
Alright so I've seen a lot of people say this same exact thing and I gotta say, it's impossible to just cancel out the super form but maybe there might be a way to prove this theory. First off it's already been suggested that with the power of the master emerald that Knuckles became the strongest character in the Sonic cannon but let's take this a different path, y'all know one of prince Vegeta's more recently gained abilities named spirit control - the ability that can do stuff like teleportation, duplication of self, and Gigantification - yeah well it can also defuse fusions.
Well what if this supposed master emerald energy was similar to "spirit control" where it can stop energy connections, first off this would be one hell of an IDW Sonic comic arc but second off what I'm saying is what if the master emerald's unique energy can stop the flow of chaos energy.
I mean the master emerald is the strongest emerald in the entire Sonic cannon already but what if it had full control over the seven chaos emeralds just like the seventh chaos emerald in Sonic the comic, well it's time I stop beating around the bush and start explaining.
Well in Sonic 3 & Knuckles the master emerald can upgrade the seven chaos emeralds into the seven super emeralds so the master emerald might and or definitely can de-grade the seven chaos emeralds into at the very least be a lot weaker so if it can do that then it definitely has the capability of at the very least weakening the connections of the chaos emeralds to it's user or move the connection to someone else, with this in mind whatever energy the master emerald emits is definitely not chaos energy but instead an energy much stronger because this said energy has the ability to just straight up weaken the chaos emeralds or empower them so if Knuckles had some of this energy then maybe he temporarily removed the chaos emeralds connection to Sonic allowing Knuckles to basically just snatch the emeralds out of Sonic's pocket or Knuckles made it to where when the chaos emeralds were connected to Sonic they were instead connected to Knuckles and no one else making Knuckles go super but maybe the change was too much for the chaos emeralds so the chaos energy quickly went back into the chaos emeralds allowing Knuckles to punch Sonic as much as he wants without a care in the world.
Now with this still in mind this theory makes it to where the master emerald has a lot of potential so I'm just going to name whatever this new master emerald energy "Master Energy" because the chaos emeralds energy is called "Chaos Energy" and chaos is the first word for chaos emeralds so why not do the same thing for the master emerald's unique energy, well that's my interpretation of what so many people have been saying and it lead to the creation of a new energy type that has a lot of unknown potential so I hope you enjoyed this theory but as a theory channel that's been going for almost 10 years now have said oh so many times-
Alright so I've seen a lot of people say this same exact thing and I gotta say, it's impossible to just cancel out the super form but maybe there might be a way to prove this theory. First off it's already been suggested that with the power of the master emerald that Knuckles became the strongest character in the Sonic cannon but let's take this a different path, y'all know one of prince Vegeta's more recently gained abilities named spirit control - the ability that can do stuff like teleportation, duplication of self, and Gigantification - yeah well it can also defuse fusions.
Well what if this supposed master emerald energy was similar to "spirit control" where it can stop energy connections, first off this would be one hell of an IDW Sonic comic arc but second off what I'm saying is what if the master emerald's unique energy can stop the flow of chaos energy.
I mean the master emerald is the strongest emerald in the entire Sonic cannon already but what if it had full control over the seven chaos emeralds just like the seventh chaos emerald in Sonic the comic, well it's time I stop beating around the bush and start explaining.
Well in Sonic 3 & Knuckles the master emerald can upgrade the seven chaos emeralds into the seven super emeralds so the master emerald might and or definitely can de-grade the seven chaos emeralds into at the very least be a lot weaker so if it can do that then it definitely has the capability of at the very least weakening the connections of the chaos emeralds to it's user or move the connection to someone else, with this in mind whatever energy the master emerald emits is definitely not chaos energy but instead an energy much stronger because this said energy has the ability to just straight up weaken the chaos emeralds or empower them so if Knuckles had some of this energy then maybe he temporarily removed the chaos emeralds connection to Sonic allowing Knuckles to basically just snatch the emeralds out of Sonic's pocket or Knuckles made it to where when the chaos emeralds were connected to Sonic they were instead connected to Knuckles and no one else making Knuckles go super but maybe the change was too much for the chaos emeralds so the chaos energy quickly went back into the chaos emeralds allowing Knuckles to punch Sonic as much as he wants without a care in the world.
Now with this still in mind this theory makes it to where the master emerald has a lot of potential so I'm just going to name whatever this new master emerald energy "Master Energy" because the chaos emeralds energy is called "Chaos Energy" and chaos is the first word for chaos emeralds so why not do the same thing for the master emerald's unique energy, well that's my interpretation of what so many people have been saying and it lead to the creation of a new energy type that has a lot of unknown potential so I hope you enjoyed this theory but as a theory channel that's been going for almost 10 years now have said oh so many times-
game theory said:
Noxious
Member
This theory right here is probably the one I agree with the most
When Sonic goes Super Sonic in a zone, I feel like he already knows what is ahead of him (which is badniks). However, he never suspected Knuckles at all. He didn't even know he was ready to attack him, and so he was shocked and let go of handling his super form.
Chezi
Chili Dogs
In response to Basic Bronze Sonic’s theories about the timeline placement, there’s a lot of evidence that contradicts it. I’d like to state beforehand that interviews with the game’s creators, while they may seem informing, have been known to contradict and confuse facts established within the games and manuals.
1. Timeline Placement
The beginning of the timeline is laid out like this: 1-2-CD-3&K. Because there’s a large gap of time between 2 and 3, that leaves enough space for CD to fit as well as explain how Metal Sonic was superior to Mecha Sonic. After 3&K, the main timeline would go towards Chaotix (where Metal Sonic reappears) and then continue with the rest of the games starting with Adventure. In the Classic Timeline, the Time Eater picks up Classic Sonic after 3&K, making his timeline go as the following: 1-2-CD-3&K-Gens-Chaotix-Mania. This also brings me to my next point...
2. Classic Sonic comes from after 3&K.
This is simply shown from the fact that he knows how to deal with Metal Sonic and the Death Egg Robot. This explains why they have different fights, with Metal Sonic’s not being a race as Robotnik chases them and the Death Egg Robot being in a different room. Also, just because he was picked up from Green Hill Zone doesn’t mean that is during Sonic 1. Green Hill has been stated to be his favorite place to run because of the hills and loops.
3. Sonic didn’t meet Tails until Sonic 2
This is simply a fact that was ignored lol
So what does this mean?
Knuckles simply pulled a fast one on Sonic during 3&K. It’s quite possible that Sonic hasn’t been using the Chaos Emeralds during that gap because we don’t see them during CD. My guess is that Tails stayed behind and studied them as Sonic took a vacation to visit Little Planet, only to realize that Robotnik took it over. Sonic’s clear lack of understanding of how they work is what Knuckles took advantage of in that opening scene.
P.S. It does seem true that Generations, the game with the least amount of story, seems to have an answer to almost every lore related question
1. Timeline Placement
The beginning of the timeline is laid out like this: 1-2-CD-3&K. Because there’s a large gap of time between 2 and 3, that leaves enough space for CD to fit as well as explain how Metal Sonic was superior to Mecha Sonic. After 3&K, the main timeline would go towards Chaotix (where Metal Sonic reappears) and then continue with the rest of the games starting with Adventure. In the Classic Timeline, the Time Eater picks up Classic Sonic after 3&K, making his timeline go as the following: 1-2-CD-3&K-Gens-Chaotix-Mania. This also brings me to my next point...
2. Classic Sonic comes from after 3&K.
This is simply shown from the fact that he knows how to deal with Metal Sonic and the Death Egg Robot. This explains why they have different fights, with Metal Sonic’s not being a race as Robotnik chases them and the Death Egg Robot being in a different room. Also, just because he was picked up from Green Hill Zone doesn’t mean that is during Sonic 1. Green Hill has been stated to be his favorite place to run because of the hills and loops.
3. Sonic didn’t meet Tails until Sonic 2
This is simply a fact that was ignored lol
So what does this mean?
Knuckles simply pulled a fast one on Sonic during 3&K. It’s quite possible that Sonic hasn’t been using the Chaos Emeralds during that gap because we don’t see them during CD. My guess is that Tails stayed behind and studied them as Sonic took a vacation to visit Little Planet, only to realize that Robotnik took it over. Sonic’s clear lack of understanding of how they work is what Knuckles took advantage of in that opening scene.
P.S. It does seem true that Generations, the game with the least amount of story, seems to have an answer to almost every lore related question