Matrix Labyrinth Zone

Hello there! I am Dr. Weegee, and for no reason at all, besides boredom, I'm making an SRB2 level o_O. And right now, I'm not sure on the name, so I'm gonna keep it as 'Matrix Labyrinth'.

Note: Some textures, and objects are from SF94-Serv, and are not created by me. And yes, I do have permission to use things for SF94-Serv.

And also, please note that images with somewhat less importance, will be 320 x 240, and images with more importance will be 640 x 480.

Screenshots:

Random level start:



Currently, I have random control towers in the level, there will be buttons for view points, and buttons to mess with people.



They currently are connected with the power of seamless teleportation =D.

Here's a screenshot of a random spike pit:



And when you get to the top, there's this:



That button makes it so a wall moves up, so you can get into an elevator, to get to the second floor. Which is apparently under you. >_>

And just for HAX, a secret. Note: There are a lot of secrets in the level so far.



Next are these, for some reason I'm using Gargoyles in a futuristic level.



At more or less the end of floor two, you will need two-three of these to get past it.

And then there's this, a random area, you have to jump across the pit, to hit a button, which will make a bridge appear.



Here's the second floor, to third floor elevator:



Right now I don't have the third, or fourth floors done yet, but they will be done when I get around to it.

If you like this HAX, use HAX, and obey Weegee O_O. Also, sorry for the long post.

Note: Some lighting effects don't currently work with OpenGL, like in those screenshots. They'll be fixed when Sonic Team Jr. Fixes this.

The level seems horrendously cramped and uninteresting. Make the platforms, the different rooms, and hallways larger. Also try to use a bit more texture variation along with level aesthetics, visually the level needs more work as well.

There is not much else shown to say anything about except it looks like some of the rooms that are supposed to give a challenge are relatively small and short lived by looking at the screenshots and there is neither that much shown about the gimmicks if there are any (or anymore if I am missing one or so) nor any other part of the level at all.

Well, when playing the level, it really doesn't feel all that com-packed. I didn't show anything related to that for a reason, and that is:

1. This level is still being worked on.
2. I didn't want to really spoil the level.
3. There are gimmicks to the level, and floor specific gimmicks. The only floor without all that many gimmicks, is the first floor, which is really just there to be something players start at, before going through the harder parts of the level.

The way I en-tended this, was for it to be three levels, with 4 floors each, and for it to be somewhat like Portal, in terms of puzzles at least. And for each map to get harder, and harder.
The main floors I'm gonna make hard, are floor three, and floor four. Also, if you read what I said, there will be a lot of secrets, so there will be extra floors.

And you do have to remember, it's called 'Matrix Labyrinth Zone' so it's made to be filled with traps, secrets, random enemies, and it's supposed to be like a maze, only not as annoying.

I know I didn't show much, but besides spoiling the level, the original post would be huge.

And you might wanna look back at the original post, because I said there would be control towers, and they would basically be towers two of the players would be able to use, and send out traps, see different view points, etc.

Anyway, enough randomly pointing out facts, thanks for the advice.

EDIT: I'm sorry I said maze before, but this was posted at 3-4 AM. o_O

DoctorWeegee said:

and it's supposed to be a maze.

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Nobody wants to search for the exit in a Sonic level, so you shouldn't do that. Also, Sonic Team Jr. will not fix the missing lightning effects in OpenGL because it's unsupported.

It looks like you're trying to rip off SF94Serv. Do you even have permssion to use that HUD for your project? Also, "Weegee" is a goddamn tired meme.

D00D64 said:

It looks like you're trying to rip off SF94Serv. Do you even have permssion to use that HUD for your project? Also, "Weegee" is a goddamn tired meme.

Click to expand...

What HUD?

D00D64 said:

It looks like you're trying to rip off SF94Serv. Do you even have permssion to use that HUD for your project? Also, "Weegee" is a goddamn tired meme.

Click to expand...

If you read my signature, you would see that I'm a BETA tester for SF94-Serv. And, for some reason the forum didn't save my signature before.

But yes, I do have permission to use what I did, even ask Mike if you don't believe me.

Michael = Mike = SonicFreak94 = SF94

I've known him for about 8 years, so I've gotten the habit of calling him Mike.

---------- Post added at 03:06 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:53 PM ----------

SpiritCrusher said:

Nobody wants to search for the exit in a Sonic level, so you shouldn't do that. Also, Sonic Team Jr. will not fix the missing lightning effects in OpenGL because it's unsupported.

Click to expand...

You do know that's the point of a good SRB2/Sonic level, right?

The whole point is to search for the end, if not, then it would be pointless, boring, uninteresting, bad, etc.

Have you ever seen a co-op SRB2 level that's good, and you're not supposed to find the end?

Really, everyone who's replied to me misses the point of co-op SRB2 levels, and thinks I stole things, even though I gave credit, and have permission.

I don't really think its "Search for the end"

More like "Dodge all these traps while trying to get to the end"

DoctorWeegee said:

You do know that's the point of a good SRB2/Sonic level, right?

The whole point is to search for the end, if not, then it would be pointless, boring, uninteresting, bad, etc.

Click to expand...

Wrong. You should always know where to go to find the end, so you don't search for it. You go in its direction and pass obstacles while reaching it. There shouldn't be any searching involved.

DoctorWeegee said:

Have you ever seen a co-op SRB2 level that's good, and you're not supposed to find the end?

Click to expand...

To be honest, I've never seen a real co-op level before.

Autosaver said:

I don't really think its "Search for the end"

More like "Dodge all these traps while trying to get to the end"

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At least someone here besides me isn't acting like an idiot.

I mean, really. Why even for a second, would anyone think that the point of a co-op level was to not get to the end?

Some people really need to read what people have posted, and know what a co-op level means, before replying.

And for anyone who doesn't get what co-op means here's a link

Co-op, meaning 'Cooperative' meaning playing with players online Cooperatively, and normally you'd be going through levels, and having fun.

Why do you think the end sign was created? It was made to be put at the end of a level.

But there are co-op levels without it, but they're specifically designed to be for exploring the level, like SF94-City for example, it has an end, but not the traditional way.

Note: That rant was about the people who were making bad replies to my post. But there are one or two good replies, with actual tips, advice, etc, that I've seen.

That is all.

---------- Post added at 04:02 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:56 PM ----------

SpiritCrusher said:

Wrong. You should always know where to go to find the end, so you don't search for it. You go in its direction and pass obstacles while reaching it. There shouldn't be any searching involved.


To be honest, I've never seen a real co-op level before.

Click to expand...

Actually no, a co-op level can be any way the creator wants it to be.

A lot of co-op levels send you in circles, and have hidden exits, and even other exits, you get the point.

So no, co-op levels do not need to be strait forward, at all.

You may have not seen many co-op levels, but they really don't have to be limited like that.

Or we can just go with whatever Mystic said.

SP,Match,CTF are the only real modes in SRB2. Therefore, none of SRB2s level focus on cooperation.

Autosaver said:

Or we can just go with whatever Mystic said.

SP,Match,CTF are the only real modes in SRB2. Therefore, none of SRB2s level focus on cooperation.

Click to expand...

I actually don't believe that.

If you play in a single player level online with others, then it's co-op.

Really, every level with a start and end are co-op levels.

So if you design a level for more than one person, and to be a level where more than one person should be playing, then it's a co-op level, just like all levels that are playable online, with the chasecam normally on.

DoctorWeegee said:

Really, every level with a start and end are co-op levels.

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No, a co-op level is a level that actually requires you to cooperate, not just a single player level played online. Also, there's a big difference between "getting to the end" and "searching for the end", like I've already said. Actually, I said the exact same thing as Autosaver. So, with other words, don't create a maze. They suck.

SpiritCrusher said:

No, a co-op level is a level that actually requires you to cooperate, not just a single player level played online. Also, there's a big difference between "getting to the end" and "searching for the end", like I've already said. Actually, I said the exact same thing as Autosaver. So, with other words, don't create a maze. They suck.

Click to expand...

First of all. You have the choice to cooperate in a single player level online, thus making it a co-op level.

Second of all. No mazes do not suck, let alone there's a difference between a maze, and a labyrinth, look it up.

Third of all. I've gotten positive feed back from a few people about the level, so I really think a 'Labyrinth' is a pretty good idea.

If you saw the rest of the level, you would agree that the level is linear, but at the same time not.

Also, there are areas I'm working on, where you will need two people, so this is a co-op level.

DoctorWeegee said:

First of all. You have the choice to cooperate in a single player level online, thus making it a co-op level.

Click to expand...

No, because co-operating is not required and is not the objective. That like saying Match and Team Match are the same because you could theoretically form teams even in regular Match mode.

DoctorWeegee said:

Second of all. No mazes do not suck, let alone there's a difference between a maze, and a labyrinth, look it up.

Click to expand...

Said difference implies that labyrinths are actually a good design for SRB2 levels, because it is always clear where the player has to go. Mazes, on the other hands, require the player to find the right path among many, facing many dead ends and needing to backtrack. That is bad design, and it doesn't get better if you simply claim it isn't without mentioning any reason.

By the way, you said yourself that the level would be maze-like. You might have meant labyrinth-like instead.

Here's what I think. Let Doctor Weegee do what he wants. If he wants a maze, he can build a maze. If he wants a labyrinth, go ahead and build that! If Spirit Crusher doesn't like that, he can make his own level with no mazes.

Chaotic Chao said:

Here's what I think. Let Doctor Weegee do what he wants. If he wants a maze, he can build a maze. If he wants a labyrinth, go ahead and build that! If Spirit Crusher doesn't like that, he can make his own level with no mazes.

Click to expand...

I don't know about him, but if I was a mapper, I would want opinions. I can't stop him from doing anything anyway.

The point of an SP or co-op level is to overcome obstacles to get to the end, not just find the end. If the point of a level was just to find its end, it would have no replay value. After a few times of playing it, the player would know exactly where to go.

The player should know which way they should go, obviously a maze wouldn't work with this. When playing the classic 2D Sonic games, it's clear in most levels that your supposed to go to the right. It's harder to keep the goal clear in 3D games. The only way make the goal clear is to listen to player's suggestions. This applies to other aspects of the level as well.

The only thing that will stop you from making a good level is to not listening to suggestions. You're making your levels for players. Try to listen to them, they're the ones playing the levels.

Cheese said:

The point of an SP or co-op level is to overcome obstacles to get to the end, not just find the end. If the point of a level was just to find its end, it would have no replay value. After a few times of playing it, the player would know exactly where to go.

The player should know which way they should go, obviously a maze wouldn't work with this. When playing the classic 2D Sonic games, it's clear in most levels that your supposed to go to the right. It's harder to keep the goal clear in 3D games. The only way make the goal clear is to listen to player's suggestions. This applies to other aspects of the level as well.

The only thing that will stop you from making a good level is to not listening to suggestions. You're making your levels for players. Try to listen to them, they're the ones playing the levels.

Click to expand...

You guys don't get it do you, the point of the level is to be fun, and to have good replay value.

I mean really, if it was a huge maze like you think, it would have a lot of replay value. For example: If a level has like 5-6 exits, that would mean you could keep finding new paths.

None of you have seen the level 100% so far, it's actually pretty linear.

I mean it's not like a huge maze, nor is it supposed to be.

'Labyrinths' do not have as many ways to go as a huge maze, but they are filled with secrets, traps, different paths, etc.

Now do you people get the difference between a maze, and a labyrinth?

And like I've said before, this level will require 2 people or more. There's already two switches that need to be stepped on at once, to keep going through the level.

Kind of reminds me of the Labyrinth Guide mission at the Castle of Glass in NiGHTS: Journey of Dreams... You had to guide Will out of this big palace, but all there were, like, 3 types of doorways... it was kind of hard to tell what was a door, a mirror, or just a barrier, since all the rooms looked the same, and the arches above each wall looked EXACTLY the same.