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-   -   Saturn MD2 Collection: Sonic Trio. (https://mb.srb2.org/showthread.php?t=42812)

davee0 07-12-2017 09:46 AM

Saturn MD2 Collection: Sonic Trio.
 
9 Attachment(s)
Hey guys !

Did you ever wanted play as Sonic R Sonic or
Sonic Jam's Sonic World Sonic, Sonic 3D Blast Special Stage for Saturn/PC Sonic, Sonic R Tails or Sonic Jam's Sonic World Tails even Knuckles ?.
NOW YOU CAN
These models are with my Custom animations, because each saturn game have different animations...

Download: Attachment 10969

Updates
Spoiler:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------;
A - Alpha Update AB - Alpha-Beta Update B - Beta Update C - Normal ;
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------;
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------;
18.7.2017 ;/; 7/18/2017 AB-Update
+Added Knuckles(55%)
+Added Sonic's Super Transformation(WIP)
+Added Sign, 1-up icon for Sonic/Knuckles (Sign need texture)
*Tweaked Sonic

20.7.2017 ;/; 7/20/2017 B-Update
-Removed Tails
+Added Miles
*Fixed Sonic grap Animation.


Things to do:
-------------------------------------------------------
-
Smooth Super Transformation
Items
Sign Texturing.
Tweak Miles's Animations.
Tweak Knux
-
-------------------------------------------------------


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Link to wiki how to set up MD2.
https://wiki.srb2.org/wiki/MD2_model

Actual MD2.dat content:
Sonic saturnsonic.md2 10.0 0.0
Tails saturntails.md2 14.0 0.0
Knuckles saturnknux.md2 9.0 0.0
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Poster of update:
http://i.imgur.com/2goCmfO.png

Prime 2.0 07-17-2017 02:33 PM

Welcome to Releases!

Lach 07-17-2017 04:42 PM

Man, you should have seen my face when I saw this thread pop up in the new posts page. Sonic R is one of my favorite childhood games and I've always wanted to play with their models in SRB2. But I'll be honest, I'm kinda disappointed. I'm not saying you haven't done a good job—I know there are currently no rigs for the Saturn models, which meant you did all the piecework, like rigging a skeleton, texturing, and making animations all by yourself. I commend you for doing all of that on your own, especially since it looks like these are your first MD2s. But if you ever update these to include the super transformations and item icons, perhaps you could make them a liiiiittle more faithful to the source material? Here are some design nitpicks I had:
Spoiler:

• The eyes are wayyyyy too small. Is there a way to make that texture cover more of the face area? Not only do they currently look way off compared to the source material, they just completely derpy in general. It makes their foreheads look huge, ahaha.

• I don't want to hammer on the animations too much since you DID do them all by yourself, which is impressive in its own right—but I found some of the dynamics choices to be a little jarring. For instance, the way the characters bob their heads when they run is completely unnatural. It's like they're jamming (no pun intended) to fire mixtapes as they speed through the zones. I'm no animation expert, but I think the up and down movement you're looking for actually stems from the entire body moving up and down instead of just the head doing a nod. Refer to this sheet for some handy animation guides. You can also study animations from MD2s by practiced modelers such as Jeck Jims' classic pack and VirtualBlitz's 06 pack. Those animations were also made by hand and they pretty much nail how movement should look.

• Looking at the modes themselves, certain proportions definitely need some work. Tails' shoes are way too big, and while his head is an oval, it should be a vertical oval rather than a horizontal one (though if you manage to fix the size of the eye textures, I don't think it'll be that big of a deal). The tips of his tails also look a little small—when he was running or flying, they looked like little white dots to me. Sonic's model looks pretty accurate to his look in Sonic R, but Tails needs some work all around if you're aiming for accuracy. Pull up a picture of Tails from Sonic R and see what you can do to get the proportions right!

Keep in mind, I'm just an avid Sonic R fan. You certainly don't have to go ahead with these changes if you like your models the way they are, but I'm sure I'm not the only one who really wants to see legitimately faithful Saturn Sonic models. Still, well done for actually doing them though. I'm glad someone put in the effort to at least make it a thing!

davee0 07-17-2017 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lach (Post 794481)
Man, you should have seen my face when I saw this thread pop up in the new posts page. Sonic R is one of my favorite childhood games and I've always wanted to play with their models in SRB2. But I'll be honest, I'm kinda disappointed. I'm not saying you haven't done a good job—I know there are currently no rigs for the Saturn models, which meant you did all the piecework, like rigging a skeleton, texturing, and making animations all by yourself. I commend you for doing all of that on your own, especially since it looks like these are your first MD2s. But if you ever update these to include the super transformations and item icons, perhaps you could make them a liiiiittle more faithful to the source material? Here are some design nitpicks I had:
Spoiler:

• The eyes are wayyyyy too small. Is there a way to make that texture cover more of the face area? Not only do they currently look way off compared to the source material, they just completely derpy in general. It makes their foreheads look huge, ahaha.

• I don't want to hammer on the animations too much since you DID do them all by yourself, which is impressive in its own right—but I found some of the dynamics choices to be a little jarring. For instance, the way the characters bob their heads when they run is completely unnatural. It's like they're jamming (no pun intended) to fire mixtapes as they speed through the zones. I'm no animation expert, but I think the up and down movement you're looking for actually stems from the entire body moving up and down instead of just the head doing a nod. Refer to this sheet for some handy animation guides. You can also study animations from MD2s by practiced modelers such as Jeck Jims' classic pack and VirtualBlitz's 06 pack. Those animations were also made by hand and they pretty much nail how movement should look.

• Looking at the modes themselves, certain proportions definitely need some work. Tails' shoes are way too big, and while his head is an oval, it should be a vertical oval rather than a horizontal one (though if you manage to fix the size of the eye textures, I don't think it'll be that big of a deal). The tips of his tails also look a little small—when he was running or flying, they looked like little white dots to me. Sonic's model looks pretty accurate to his look in Sonic R, but Tails needs some work all around if you're aiming for accuracy. Pull up a picture of Tails from Sonic R and see what you can do to get the proportions right!

Keep in mind, I'm just an avid Sonic R fan. You certainly don't have to go ahead with these changes if you like your models the way they are, but I'm sure I'm not the only one who really wants to see legitimately faithful Saturn Sonic models. Still, well done for actually doing them though. I'm glad someone put in the effort to at least make it a thing!

I don't know, but I can't make it better with faces. And I will maybe disappoint you more, because I am aiming to make mix of these Two/Three games in terms of animations and model itself.

These aren't my first real MD2s even. I am only first time experienced with bone joints really.

And these aren't definitely final versions of both these models, I am planning to make from Ground up new animations and little fixies. When I will be done with Animations then I will go to make objects like monitors, springs, signpost. When I will be done with objects then I will make Signpost and 1-up Icon for Character itself. And it will take while, because it isn’t my only project.

Edit: Ehh.... I failed, I have now faces right.

Lach 07-17-2017 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davee0 (Post 794484)
I don't know, but I can't make it better with faces. And I will maybe disappoint you more, because I am aiming to make mix of these Two/Three games in terms of animations and model itself.

These aren't my first real MD2s even. I am only first time experienced with bone joints really.

And these aren't definitely final versions of both these models, I am planning to make from Ground up new animations and little fixies. When I will be done with Animations then I will go to make objects like monitors, springs, signpost. When I will be done with objects then I will make Signpost and 1-up Icon for Character itself. And it will take while, because it isn’t my only project.

Edit: Ehh.... I failed, I have now faces right.

Don't worry yourself too much about it. My suggestions are based around how I think they should be, but you can take as much or as little of that criticism as you see fit. I'm glad you are taking it into consideration and will continue to work on them, though! Take your time and keep up the good work.

EDIT:
https://imgur.com/download/yG4yGPK
I managed to upsize Sonic's face myself. Even though I think Sonic R's standards would require it to go a teensy bit bigger, I don't think you'd need to go any bigger than this to make it fit the blend between all the Saturn games you wanted to achieve. Honestly, as long as the eyes don't look small like they currently do, it should be all. Whenever you have the motivation, I think Tails is the one in need of those from-the-ground-up animations you were talking about, whereas Sonic is mostly fine—so I would focus on fixing Tails' model and animations first!

davee0 07-20-2017 11:28 AM

Update 18-20.7.2017 ;/; 7/18-20/2017
 
UPDATE !!!!!
----------------------------
Hey, Guys !

This update removes toiles and adds Miles. Still need tweak, but that's small thing.
Also added Ugly knuckles. I need just little bit of time.... to tweak him. But everything else is alright.

Poster of this update is :
http://i.imgur.com/2goCmfO.png

Lach 07-22-2017 07:22 PM

Good work! Sonic looks pretty damn good now. I still think some of his animations are a liiiiiittle bit stiff and definitely asymmetrical in many areas, but he's in a good place at the moment. Tails and Knuckles definitely need a lot more work, but of course this is my personal feedback so don't feel like you need to account for every detail if you like any particular quality about your models. With that said:

Your improvement on Tails is excellent; his proportions are much more accurate and his model is overall wayyyy better looking! Nice job. I still think there are a couple of design flaws, though. His twin tails definitely still need some enlivening. The white area needs to be made bigger, and I hesitate to say this in case it backfires, but perhaps the tails need just a smidgen of thickening as well? They need to be a little more solid and visible, since I think Tails' biggest problem currently lies in his animations. The ones where his tails move, such as running and flying, particularly need attention since those are the ones where the tails are basically the only bits that are actually in motion. They happen to be the animations the majority of players will see the most playing as Tails, so those definitely need the most attention. For flying, I would angle the tails further (but not completely, of course) towards the horizontal, like a helicopter—since that's how it is in most games. At the moment they kind of unnaturally stick up in the air and twirl around. Make sure the tips point outwards rather than up, as well. I think the same would go for running, too. Speaking of which, his hands are placed very awkwardly during that running animation. Perhaps his arms are too long? Feel free to experiment a bit.

I know your Knuckles is heavily in beta so I won't go into too much detail, but one thing that really irks me is that his motions are definitely asymmetrical and a little jerky. I noticed that all of his frames seem to be slightly angled to the left ever so slightly, but maybe that's just me. Viewing his running animation from the front reveals that his head moves side to side in a very unnatural fashion. I also feel that his jump animation rotates around an off-center radius. He has twisted feet during his climb, but that animation is probably still being worked on, as is the very placeholder-looking balancing animation. It's a pretty good start though! He looks a little skinny as well, and I think that's because his limbs are skinnier than those of the other two.

Overall, good improvements! I'm glad you're continuing to work on these. In general, try to keep all animations smooth but lively, and making things symmetrical (if it is possible) will always give a huuuge quality boost to your work. :)

davee0 07-23-2017 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lach (Post 794566)
Good work! Sonic looks pretty damn good now. I still think some of his animations are a liiiiiittle bit stiff and definitely asymmetrical in many areas, but he's in a good place at the moment. Tails and Knuckles definitely need a lot more work, but of course this is my personal feedback so don't feel like you need to account for every detail if you like any particular quality about your models. With that said:

Your improvement on Tails is excellent; his proportions are much more accurate and his model is overall wayyyy better looking! Nice job. I still think there are a couple of design flaws, though. His twin tails definitely still need some enlivening. The white area needs to be made bigger, and I hesitate to say this in case it backfires, but perhaps the tails need just a smidgen of thickening as well? They need to be a little more solid and visible, since I think Tails' biggest problem currently lies in his animations. The ones where his tails move, such as running and flying, particularly need attention since those are the ones where the tails are basically the only bits that are actually in motion. They happen to be the animations the majority of players will see the most playing as Tails, so those definitely need the most attention. For flying, I would angle the tails further (but not completely, of course) towards the horizontal, like a helicopter—since that's how it is in most games. At the moment they kind of unnaturally stick up in the air and twirl around. Make sure the tips point outwards rather than up, as well. I think the same would go for running, too. Speaking of which, his hands are placed very awkwardly during that running animation. Perhaps his arms are too long? Feel free to experiment a bit.

I know your Knuckles is heavily in beta so I won't go into too much detail, but one thing that really irks me is that his motions are definitely asymmetrical and a little jerky. I noticed that all of his frames seem to be slightly angled to the left ever so slightly, but maybe that's just me. Viewing his running animation from the front reveals that his head moves side to side in a very unnatural fashion. I also feel that his jump animation rotates around an off-center radius. He has twisted feet during his climb, but that animation is probably still being worked on, as is the very placeholder-looking balancing animation. It's a pretty good start though! He looks a little skinny as well, and I think that's because his limbs are skinnier than those of the other two.

Overall, good improvements! I'm glad you're continuing to work on these. In general, try to keep all animations smooth but lively, and making things symmetrical (if it is possible) will always give a huuuge quality boost to your work. :)

RE:
Thank you for criticism and I know Miles' tails are badly animated, because of low polycount Miles's tails are hard to animate. So I will try my best. And Knuckles will be redesign to be more like Sonic R/Sonic 3D Blast variant.
And I like to note I had problems with camera angles (I taken screenshots of game and made them as background in MM3D, But often camera was off).
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Q:
Today I was in Dilemma. I saw sonic mania's screenshot of special stages.
Should I wait on Sonic Mania and try to make similar animations or just continue with these models.
(Simplistic version of this question: Should I accept sonic mania as saturn game.)

Lach 07-24-2017 03:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by davee0 (Post 794574)
RE:
Thank you for criticism and I know Miles' tails are badly animated, because of low polycount Miles's tails are hard to animate. So I will try my best. And Knuckles will be redesign to be more like Sonic R/Sonic 3D Blast variant.
And I like to note I had problems with camera angles (I taken screenshots of game and made them as background in MM3D, But often camera was off).
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Q:
Today I was in Dilemma. I saw sonic mania's screenshot of special stages.
Should I wait on Sonic Mania and try to make similar animations or just continue with these models.
(Simplistic version of this question: Should I accept sonic mania as saturn game.)

No problem man. You're doing well!

Sure, you can take inspiration from the Mania model if you want. IIRC, we haven't seen the front of it yet so it's hard to know if it'll be easy enough to integrate, but it's definitely Saturn-inspired, or else they wouldn't use such a model. I know someone else is working on Sonic R models for SRB2 anyway, so you looking into Mania will make each of you guys' models stand out from each other!

U L T R A 08-02-2017 12:05 AM

I have an idea you should add md2s for Amy you could add the sonic the fighters/sonic championship model and mabye you could add Espio with his model from fighters and another great idea would be Metal Sonic With his sonic r model and last an eggman boss model. if you could make this happen i would be real happy thanks for reading if you are

Kubase123 10-22-2017 10:10 AM

These looks sooo good i love them :D

Sinny33 06-30-2018 12:48 AM

I like these a lot maybe you could do more of this amazing look with an improved knuckles.


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